The Game Show Forum
The Game Show Forum => The Big Board => Topic started by: johnnya2k3 on October 25, 2014, 12:29:39 AM
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For decades, there have a slew of syndicated game shows besides Wheel, Jeopardy, and Family Feud airing on many stations in the country's top markets. But then there were others that never saw the light of day in the country's top markets.
One huge example was "Every Second Counts." Even though it was cleared in Los Angeles and Chicago, it did not air in the #1 market: New York City!!! Then again, the show was doomed right from the start; it may or may not have aired on any or all of Group W's stations. (I did see it in L.A., because Phoenix (where I was living at the time) passed on it)
And on another board, I discussed the lesser-known shows Atlanta -- now a top 10 market -- got to see; the following that got bupkis clearance are:
Make Me Laugh (Bobby Van)
Pitfall
$ale of the Century (nighttime)
Jeopardy! (Art Fleming nighttime)
Go For It! TV
Guilty or Innocent (the very forgotten courtroom/game show hybrid)
Anything You Can Do
Camouflage (I think, but have yet to look at any 1980 listings from the Atlanta Journal-Constitution to confirm this)
The aforementioned Every Second Counts
Were there any others that the large markets said "NO" to?
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Los Angeles said "No" to the 1985-1986 nighttime $ale of the Century (but New York City said "Yes"), and I remember Jimmy Owen telling me that the weekly nighttime edition (1973-1974) never got cleared in either N.Y. or L.A.
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The first few months of syndie Wheel didn't air in either NYC or LA (might've been both, I forget). It eventually premiered in the spring of 1984.
I believe the first few weeks of Trebek's Jeopardy! aired, then it was gone. In the first Jeopardy! book, Trebek recalls reruns of Quincy airing in its place. I think it returned to LA sometime in early-1985.
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So Every Second Counts never aired in New York? Wow. Strange.
As far as the others you mentioned, JohnnyA:
Anything For Money did (WCBS)
Pitfall I don't know about first run but if I recall, WLIG (now WLNY) aired reruns of it and the original Cullen Pyramid for a few years in the 80s
Sale, yes, as mentioned (WOR/WABC as mentioned by me dozens of times lol)
I don't know about the weekly syndie Jeopardy but if I'm not mistaken the Metromedia stations picked up everything the parent company distributed, so I would bet yes and that WNEW carried it
College Mad House did (WNBC)
As far as the other three go, I've only heard of Camouflage and couldn't tell you about it.
It's really rare that a syndicated game show ''doesn't'' get picked up in New York- at least one intended for broad and not regional syndication (such as Let's Ask America and 100%). As a matter of fact, I've heard of New York being an almost guaranteed pickup even if the show doesn't sell widely (Jim Peck's You Don't Say and 1980s Split Second being examples). Hell, WABC kept airing Match Game PM even after the daily syndicated series launched.
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PM and the daily syndicated series ran concurrently for two seasons.
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PM and the daily syndicated series ran concurrently for two seasons.
But not in every market as I understood it.
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Cleveland got Hollywood Squares/H^2 for only about the first 13 weeks of the show's run in 1998. Sale of the Century's syndicated run and The $1,000,000 Chance of a Lifetime didn't air here until their second seasons; Sale was one of WBNX's launch shows when it started in 1986, while WJW picked up Chance at the start of season 2. Related to Chance, Cleveland didn't get Catch Phrase. Other shows not shown in this market include Strike It Rich and Headline Chasers, and that's not including the plethora of network games not seen here--Bruce Forsyth's Hot Streak, Trivia Trap, Blackout, Now You See It (1989), Match Game (1990), Caesar's Challenge, et al.
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In Chicago, Narz Concentration never aired, and TTTT didn't air from about 1970-76.
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Scratched off College Mad House, which according to a tape trade page, did air in Atlanta (and on WSB, nonetheless).
But what if the other uncleared shows got cleared in the ATL after all? Here's who would've carried them:
$ale of the Century--WSB
Jeopardy! (Fleming nighttime)--WAGA
Pitfall--WGCL
Every Second Counts--WSB or WATL
Make Me Laugh--WXIA
Camouflage--WSB
But I've spent some parts of the summer scouring through decades of listings from AJC microfilms and noticed that WSB was not that big on the popular syndie game shows. Even though they would get TTD and TJW from WXIA (as well as Match Game reruns as late at 1985), they even aired the lesser-known So You Think You Got Troubles?!, TTD '90, Catch Phrase, TPIR (Tom Kennedy), Card Sharks (Bill Rafferty), Triple Threat (they had to; Cox -- WSB's parent company -- used to own Television Program Enterprises (TPE)), and That's Amore to go along the aforementioned College Mad House. Somebody at WSB -- Monica Kaufman Pearson, perhaps? -- must've been a secret fan.
WAGA on the other hand, carried only Season 1 of $128,000 Question, TJW '90, Trump Card, You Bet Your Life (Buddy Hackett), Don Adams Screen Test, $1.98 Beauty Show, and believe it or not, Jackpot! '89 (at 5:00 am!).
Of the big three, it's WXIA that has had the heaviest load, though they've also ran The Challengers, You Bet Your Life (Bill Cosby), Headline Chasers, Wipeout, TPIR (Doug Davidson), Quiz Kids Challenge, Truth or Consequences '87, and Merv Griffin's Crosswords.
I've also listed dozens of other lesser-known shows that also aired here...which I'll save for Off-Topic.
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Other shows not shown in [Cleveland] include Strike It Rich
WJW wasn't even interested in Strike It Rich (though they and then-fellow Storer station WAGA did air Break The Bank)?!
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Other shows not shown in [Cleveland] include Strike It Rich
WJW wasn't even interested in Strike It Rich (though they and then-fellow Storer station did air Break The Bank)?!
You can add "Bullseye" to the list. The only time I saw that game was when I would either visit relatives in Detroit (It was either on WDIV or WJBK), or when you could pick up the Detroit stations across Lake Erie on a good atmospheric night.
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I mentioned Wheel and Jeopardy! above...to show just how much syndication had changed in the 15 years after that, Gordon Elliott did a pilot for Let's Make a Deal in 1998 or '99. It didn't sell, in part because it couldn't get clearance in NY or LA...
I visited family in Dallas frequently between Thanksgiving '98 and spring '99. I'm trying to remember if they got MG 98, not counting the WGN feed.
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I mentioned this before, but, the 1980-81 version of To Tell The Truth never ran in Los Angeles; however, it did run on KCOY (CBS affiliate) in Santa Maria near where I live. So I was able to catch that one.
Cordially,
Tammy
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Okay, so you bring that up...if you live in an area where you can pull in from other areas, as Tammy cites, or in parts of the Delaware Valley where you can get New York and Philly or Philly and Baltimore stations, are you considered part of multiple markets, or realistically none at all because of your pickups?
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However we didn't get the Syndicated $ale of the Century in the San Francisco Bay Area at least KOVR in Sacramento airs the show along with WOR (now WWOR My9) in NYC for those who have Cable Television.
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However we didn't get the Syndicated $ale of the Century in the San Francisco Bay Area at least KOVR in Sacramento airs the show along with WOR (now WWOR My9) in NYC for those who have Cable Television.
The EMI went all the way out to Frisco? Nice.
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Other shows not shown in [Cleveland] include Strike It Rich
WJW wasn't even interested in Strike It Rich (though they and then-fellow Storer station WAGA did air Break The Bank)?!
I would guess WJW was disenchanted with how Break the Bank did. Doing some research through the Plain Dealer online database (yay perks of being a Cleveland teacher), Break the Bank went from 4 PM to 9:30 AM sometime in early 1986.
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Not first-run, but I don't think NY got the syndicated rerun package of PYLs.
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Not first-run, but I don't think NY got the syndicated rerun package of PYLs.
To the best of my knowledge they didn't. I didn't even know there was a rerun package until years later, and I believe that I learned this through the GSF.
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I don't even know when exactly did PYL's rerun package air, prior to the USA reruns, which began on September 14, 1987. All I know was that it was the February 25-August 23, 1985 episodes (as Ian Wallis said), and that they had a Republic Pictures logo, as well as a Whammy voiceover, at the end of each of them saying something like "these contestants get away with murder on the next Press Your Luck".
If I had to take a guess, I'd say it aired during Winter and Spring 1987. One or two cycles.
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Not first-run, but I don't think NY got the syndicated rerun package of PYLs.
To the best of my knowledge they didn't. I didn't even know there was a rerun package until years later, and I believe that I learned this through the GSF.
IIRC it was only sold to markets that never aired PYL in first run. Baltimore, Rochester (NY), and Miami were three with the first two ironically airing on the then-CBS stations that passed on PYL to begin with.
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Chicago also has the rare case of a network show not clearing on an O&O station--WBBM never carried the first half-hour of Family Feud Challenge. They carried the second half-hour after TPIR.
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I don't even know when exactly did PYL's rerun package air, prior to the USA reruns, which began on September 14, 1987. All I know was that it was the February 25-August 23, 1985 episodes (as Ian Wallis said), and that they had a Republic Pictures logo, as well as a Whammy voiceover, at the end of each of them saying something like "these contestants get away with murder on the next Press Your Luck".
If I had to take a guess, I'd say it aired during Winter and Spring 1987. One or two cycles.
I believe it was syndicated in early 1987. Original plans were to produce 100 new episodes for syndication, but obviously there wasn't enough interest so reruns were syndicated to a handful of stations instead.
Pittsburgh was another city that got the reruns. CFMT in Toronto also had them, but oddly enough CITY, another Toronto station aired the show first run during most of 1985.
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Chicago also has the rare case of a network show not clearing on an O&O station--WBBM never carried the first half-hour of Family Feud Challenge. They carried the second half-hour after TPIR.
Similar to what happened in syndication to Dawson comeback era.
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IIRC it was only sold to markets that never aired PYL in first run. Baltimore, Rochester (NY), and Miami were three with the first two ironically airing on the then-CBS stations that passed on PYL to begin with.
As verified in the July 10, 1987 issue of "Item" (the TV supplement to the Gettysburg Times), WBAL-11 aired PYL at 10:00 a.m., pre-empting 25K Pyramid. CS was also pre-empted at 10:30 a.m. for "Dating Game".
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Let's Ask America isn't airing in Atlanta, as did (after looking at old threads) Trivial Pursuit: America Plays.
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Here are the shows that never cleared Chicago
Narz Concentration
Kennedy Price Is Right
Face The Music
Bullseye, a bit surprising WFLD 32 didn't pick it up since they were airing just about all the other syndicated Barry and Enright game shows Tic Tac Dough, Joker's Wild, Hollywood Connection, Play The Percentages
syndicated Fleming Jeopardy
Pitfall
$128,000 Question
original Crosswits only ran like four months on WFLD 32 in the spring-summer 1978
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Let's Ask America isn't airing in Atlanta
This is actually a great example, if not the best one yet. The show currently does not air (http://letsaskamerica.tv/page/2013/08/05/when-its-on/) in any of the top 10 markets. The largest market is actually Phoenix, at #11.
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Chicago also has the rare case of a network show not clearing on an O&O station--WBBM never carried the first half-hour of Family Feud Challenge. They carried the second half-hour after TPIR.
On the subject of network shows not being cleared, WNEM in Saginaw didn't clear Brady LMAD for at least the first season.
Also, I believe someone once said that WEYI, back when it was CBS, didn't clear TPIR for a while.
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Chicago also has the rare case of a network show not clearing on an O&O station--WBBM never carried the first half-hour of Family Feud Challenge. They carried the second half-hour after TPIR.
On the subject of network shows not being cleared, WNEM in Saginaw didn't clear Brady LMAD for at least the first season.
Also, I believe someone once said that WEYI, back when it was CBS, didn't clear TPIR for a while.
In Saginaw, LMAD was on WNEM 2, the My affiliate sub-channel for the first couple years. When Nate Berkus went off, LMAD was moved to WNEM 1. I mentioned here that when TPIR went to an hour, WEYI aired the 700 Club and later other programming covering the hour-long TPIR. The general manager of WEYI disliked TPIR and said so on an "Ask the Manager" call-in show. (He didn't mention the ca$h he got for running 700 Club). This lasted until the early 80's. We did get the Dennis James version of TPIR on WJRT (ABC) at night.
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Let's Ask America isn't airing in Atlanta
This is actually a great example, if not the best one yet. The show currently does not air (http://letsaskamerica.tv/page/2013/08/05/when-its-on/) in any of the top 10 markets. The largest market is actually Phoenix, at #11.
That's because Scripps doesn't own any stations in the top 10 markets (and I used to live in Phoenix about 30 years ago)!
Another show that may have gotten zero clearance in Atlanta, unless the listings say otherwise: Break The Bank (1976 nighttime version with Jack Barry). But Atlanta was probably a top 20 or 30 market at the time; they cracked the top 10 in the mid-'90s after the Olympics.
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Interesting. I thought they'd finally added non-Scripps stations to the list. Regardless of ownership group, point still stands.
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There is an episode of Now You See It, where neither contestant can answer the question, "Who is the host of Concentration?" And Jack then after milking the laughs then points out that Concentration isn't airing in the LA market at that point which explains why neither contestant could know the answer was right in front of them!
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However we didn't get the Syndicated $ale of the Century in the San Francisco Bay Area at least KOVR in Sacramento airs the show along with WOR (now WWOR My9) in NYC for those who have Cable Television.
You mean the Garagiola version? KGO aired one season of it (on Sunday nights, I think).
Here's what I remember not airing in the San Francisco area in the 1970s (or thereabouts):
Masquerade Party
Break the Bank (Jack Barry-hosted version)
only the first two seasons of Narz Concentration aired, and even then, only once a week
syndie TPIR aired for its first two seasons, then not again until (I think) 1980
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Interesting. I thought they'd finally added non-Scripps stations to the list. Regardless of ownership group, point still stands.
Well, if it's successful, maybe they could expand Let's Ask America to non-Scripps markets next season (WSB will no doubt bury it to 2:00 am, sending Meredith Vieira -- who occupies that time slot now -- to WAGA (where they'll reluctantly pair her with Steve Harvey's talker) where it belongs).
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And speaking of ownership groups...there was an ad in Broadcasting (and Cable) from 1985 about nighttime $ale of the Century being sold to Cox and Storer stations (among others); but alas, flagships WSB and WAGA both turned it down.
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And speaking of ownership groups...there was an ad in Broadcasting (and Cable) from 1985 about nighttime $ale of the Century being sold to Cox and Storer stations (among others); but alas, flagships WSB and WAGA both turned it down.
You could add WJ(K)W in Cleveland and WTVG in Toledo as two other Storer stations that never aired Sale. I didn't recall seeing Sale on on Storer's WJBK in Detroit, either.
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And speaking of ownership groups...there was an ad in Broadcasting (and Cable) from 1985 about nighttime $ale of the Century being sold to Cox and Storer stations (among others); but alas, flagships WSB and WAGA both turned it down.
You could add WJ(K)W in Cleveland and WTVG in Toledo as two other Storer stations that never aired Sale. I didn't recall seeing Sale on on Storer's WJBK in Detroit, either.
As for Cox? KTVU in San Francisco (now a Fox O&O) also said "no Sale", but WSOC, WFTV, WPXI, and/or WHIO said "yes."
Speaking of Detroit...since they were still an ABC O&O at the time, did Sale end up on WXYZ?
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Speaking of Detroit...since they were still an ABC O&O at the time, did Sale end up on WXYZ?
Yes. They carried it from the very beginning (January 7, 1985), and were one of the 24 stations (According to Broadcasting Magazine) to do so.
WXYZ didn't have it for the whole run, though, per Jimmy Owen a couple of years ago.
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In Scranton PA, WNEP did not carry Monty Hall's Split Second until it got cancelled n the fall of 1987 right after High Rollers!
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In Scranton PA, WNEP did not carry Monty Hall's Split Second until it got cancelled n the fall of 1987 right after High Rollers!
I read that New York City was the only major market that cleared Split Second in first-run while L.A., Chicago, Philadelphia, etc. all said "thanks, but no thanks." After all, NYC passed on Every Second Counts two years earlier.
Here in Atlanta, it aired on WUPA sometime in the mornings or afternoons; I didn't find out what time while glancing through all those listings (anybody know?).
And right before LMAD '84, Monty also hosted the very short-lived "The Joke's On Us"...another show Atlanta never got to see (that, Split Second '86, and LMAD '80 -- the latter aired on WGCL -- were all produced in Canada but got poor clearances in the States)!
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In Scranton PA, WNEP did not carry Monty Hall's Split Second until it got cancelled n the fall of 1987 right after High Rollers!
That's true - it had the dubious distinction of replacing (on the weekday schedule) a long-running local children's show called "Hatchy Milatchy". HM was relegated to Saturday morning for the rest of its run (which was only a year or so). The next show to occupy that 9-10am timeslot has been on ever since...started out with Regis & Kathie Lee. :)
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According to our friend Zach Horan: WCAU in Philadelphia also aired Split Second late at 9:30 AM from September 1987 to September 1988. Also Crosswits was shown during the summer of 1988.
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According to our friend Zach Horan
(http://media0.giphy.com/media/L4caiF7GTkgJa/200w.gif)
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I was being facetious
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Though not necessarily a major market, I remember New Orleans (currently #51) clearing all the new game shows that came and went in 1990; all of them, except Quiz Kids Challenge!
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UPDATE: Just looked at one week's listings from 1984 and found out that Anything For Money did air here in Atlanta as well...on WATL weeknights at 11:00 before moving it to 6:00 pm halfway into the season (opposite the news on WSB, WAGA, and WXIA)!!
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What about the others from 1984? Like NTT
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What about the others from 1984? Like NTT
New York had it for certain and if the airing pattern is any indication they had no idea what to do with it.
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Like I said at the beginning of this thread, Every Second Counts wasn't cleared in Phoenix -- Los Angeles was the closest market with it -- but the other shows did including that god-awful Guilty Or Innocent.
IIRC, KTSP (KSAZ) had Anything For Money, Jeopardy, and All-New LMAD while Name That Tune (Jim Lange) was on KTVK (I moved back to Alaska around the time they got Sale of the Century).
In addition to AFM, Atlantans saw LMAD on WSB (same station as the '70s nighttime version; 1980-81 was on WGCL as previously mentioned), Name That Tune was only Saturdays on WXIA (they probably showed a winning episode from the week), and no need discussing Jeopardy's history here. Every Second Counts? They had to get somebody from Birmingham, Chattanooga, or Greenville to tape it for them; unsure about Macon, Savannah, or Augusta.
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Another syndie show that also didn't clear Atlanta: The Cheap Show.
The following year, Mindreaders would get uncleared on the network side, meaning Dick Martin fans here were better off with "Laugh-In" instead (half-hour reruns would be syndicated in 1983).
And "Yahtzee" (with Peter Marshall)? Unless I'm proven wrong, Atlanta also said "HELL NO!!" to it.
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I don't know about the weekly syndie Jeopardy but if I'm not mistaken the Metromedia stations picked up everything the parent company distributed, so I would bet yes and that WNEW carried it
Actually, the nighttime Fleming Jeopardy was on the then-NBC O&Os WNBC (New York), KNBC (Los Angeles), WRC (Washington), and WKYC (Cleveland, now Tegna-owned) all at 7:30 pm to go along with the daytime show; WMAQ in Chicago -- and as mentioned, the Chicago market itself -- turned it down.
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WMAQ in Chicago -- and as mentioned, the Chicago market itself -- turned it down.
If it was mentioned, why did you mention it again?
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WMAQ in Chicago -- and as mentioned, the Chicago market itself -- turned it down.
If it was mentioned, why did you mention it again?
As a refresher.
But either WMAQ could've slotted nighttime Jeopardy on the weekends or WFLD or maybe WCIU picked it up (WGN at the time wasn't game show-friendly); the closest market to Chicago that cleared it, I think, was Milwaukee.
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Sorry for the bump; according to a Facebook post, the nighttime TPIR with Tom Kennedy never cleared Boston as well (Doug Davidson’s was on WBZ).