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Seeing the Kennedy PW+'s again reminded me of the stories of how Gene Rayburn, Peter Marshall, and Bill Cullen were also candidates as Allen's permanent successor. Now from the stories I know why each couldn't or didn't want to do it (a little fuzzy on Peter's situation though). But my question is, how well of a fit do you think PW+ would have been for each of the hosts?
Bill of course did a good job as usual in his four weeks as sub host. I talked a bit about Gene on my GSN review (over at my Blurty...visit today! ;-)) and how BTB85 was actually close as far as the puzzles. But of course it wasn't the "same" Gene there, as by his admission (I believe) it was a straight Q&A otherwise...at least the main game was. I thought the main game was easily BTB's better half (both with Gene and Joe Farago), I'd imagine it'd be even better given guest stars for Gene to interact with. Still, it would be odd to see him outside of MG. As for Peter...his voice ever so slightly resembled that of Allen's, but other than that I really haven't seen much of him outside of HS-like shows. So can't really call that one.
What do you think, sirs?
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I'm going to go off the board and vote for Art Fleming. In your mind's ear, listen to him call out those Alphabetics board letters with each successful solve.
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If not Tom, then Bill. Gene would have been too restrained (plus he'd have to be in Cali more than he would have liked.) Peter would have been ok. All three were doing five-day-a-week shows at the time so they may have been too busy. Tom was only doing two NTTs a week in addition to P+. Of course, had Whew! survived.......
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I had thought that is The Price is Right hadn't been successful, Bob Barker would have been great as a Password host.
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[quote name=\'daveromanjr\' date=\'Apr 7 2005, 02:47 PM\']I had thought that is The Price is Right hadn't been successful, Bob Barker would have been great as a Password host.
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I disagree. (Now here's where we need Peter Marshall!) Bob is wonderful with audience participation games like TorC and TPIR, or even beauty pageants--anything where he gets lots of time to interact with the participants and isn't bound too strictly by the format. A format-driven show like P+ would restrict him too much. He might have been a competent replacement, but I don't think he would have been the best choice.
Of those suggested in the original query, I'd have to go with Uncle Bill. Art Fleming, however, isn't a bad suggestion. Art James, Jack Narz, or even Jim Peck would have been good, too.
Then there's always the possibility that Bert Convy could have gotten the job. Although many have problems with his schmoozing with the stars, there's no denying he got 4 1/2 years out of SP, so perhaps he wouldn't have been a bad choice for the P+ job, either.
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I think Gene would have done a good job. He's a smart guy, and he wasn't as wild at the end of MG's run as he was earlier.
Seeing Convy on Super Password this week, he reminds me a little of John Davidson doing Pyramid, just in that the game's a little cerebral for him. Obviously, he can run a game much better than Davidson, and granted, it did have a good run, but it wasn't the perfect match, as Tattletales was.
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[quote name=\'Mike Tennant\' date=\'Apr 7 2005, 03:16 PM\']Then there's always the possibility that Bert Convy could have gotten the job. Although many have problems with his schmoozing with the stars, there's no denying he got 4 1/2 years out of SP, so perhaps he wouldn't have been a bad choice for the P+ job, either.
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That's interesting...as seeing PW+ again, I notice that when Tom started hosting, it started feeling a bit more like SP...I can't totally explain it, but somehow I thought of what you said about Bert above. Tom was quite less subdued than Allen, so maybe that's it?
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What would you think of Eubanks doing Password? If a new version of Super Password came along, I could see it..a bit older, doing fewer goofy grins, reacting to odd clues like he did to some of the Newlywed Game answers. The old Password benefitted from a more cerebral host, making a simple game come off as classier. Keep him just moving the game along in a classic hosting style, and a little more casual..do you think he could pull it off?
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[quote name=\'The Ol' Guy\' date=\'Apr 7 2005, 09:02 PM\']What would you think of Eubanks doing Password? If a new version of Super Password came along, I could see it..
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My God. I would plunge a knife directly into my skull.
"Fourth and final cluuuuuuuuuuuuuuuue."
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[quote name=\'clemon79\' date=\'Apr 8 2005, 02:26 AM\']My God. I would plunge a knife directly into my skull.
"Fourth and final cluuuuuuuuuuuuuuuue."
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No, wait, let me guess...You don't like Bob Eubanks?
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I can't stand Tomtato Head Eubanks, either.
If a new version of Password came out, I think Marc Summers would be a good host of it. He's laid back enough but I think he'd keep the game moving.
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Fair enough. Figure he's incapable of a style transplant, eh? I may have hoped too much...
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[quote name=\'ilb4ever2000\' date=\'Apr 8 2005, 02:40 AM\']No, wait, let me guess...You don't like Bob Eubanks?
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[quote name=\'The Ol' Guy\' date=\'Apr 8 2005, 06:02 AM\']Fair enough. Figure he's incapable of a style transplant, eh? I may have hoped too much...
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The fact that he's spent 30+ years hosting every show in the same pukey DJ style pretty much proves that, I think.
Mind, there are hosts I hate FAR more than Eubanks. I simply think his style (which is damned perfect for The Newlywed Game) was inappropriate for some of the shows he's done, and that some of the suggestions for shows he'd be good at are, with all due respect, wrong. My own damn opinion, nobody elses. :)
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Byron Allen, fresh off of "Real People", should have been considered.
Whoops! Posting on the wrong topic. Continue....
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[quote name=\'tvwxman\' date=\'Apr 8 2005, 04:11 PM\']Byron Allen, fresh off of "Real People", should have been considered.
Whoops! Posting on the wrong topic. Continue....
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Actually, I'd propose Bill Rafferty.
He's truly under-rated as a host. He did a great job with CS and BB '87.
The thing with P+ is that firstly, TK was picked in part by Betty and Allen themselves to take over. As Betty said "Tom took good care of Password", and secondly, if you watch the show and see the wide shots, it looks like Ludden is still there. Tom has the same glasses and overall appearance.
(Note he looks *younger* on TPIR 85, and that's probably because they had him dye his hair for the job)
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[quote name=\'Terry K\' date=\'Apr 8 2005, 07:35 PM\']
if you watch the show and see the wide shots, it looks like Ludden is still there. Tom has the same glasses and overall appearance.
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As with most of us, I was a game show fan from a young age. I didn't know who Allen Ludden and Tom Kennedy were until I got a little older, but when I was about 6 1/2 or 7, and watching that show, I remember thinking, "I don't think that's the same guy that they started with..."
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The fact that he's spent 30+ years hosting every show in the same pukey DJ style pretty much proves that, I think.
"It's more than Password -- it's Password Puke!"
TK was picked in part by Betty and Allen themselves to take over.
Don't believe everything you read in celebrity autobiographies.
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[quote name=\'chris319\' date=\'Apr 8 2005, 06:44 PM\']
TK was picked in part by Betty and Allen themselves to take over.
Don't believe everything you read in celebrity autobiographies.
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That's why I said in part
To refresh my memory, Chris, can you post anything on the actual selection of TK?
I really think TK did a good job with P+ and made the show his. Also, he had very big shoes to fill, and he filled them well.
G-T seemed to do an excellent job picking hosts for their creations and revivals.
Not to change the topic but who was the WORST host that G-T ever drafted?
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Allen and Betty were very tight-lipped about Allen's illness until he suffered his stroke. For Allen and/or Betty to have "picked" or even suggested a long-term replacement would have tipped us off to the seriousness of his illness.
Not to change the topic but who was the WORST host that G-T ever drafted?
It would be betwen Dick Martin and Sonny Fox.
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[quote name=\'chris319\' date=\'Apr 8 2005, 07:26 PM\']Allen and Betty were very tight-lipped about Allen's illness until he suffered his stroke. For Allen and/or Betty to have "picked" or even suggested a long-term replacement would have tipped us off to the seriousness of his illness.
Not to change the topic but who was the WORST host that G-T ever drafted?
It would be betwen Dick Martin and Sonny Fox.
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Well, there's always Lee Bowman, but that was before your time. And I think Frank Buxton was probably a washout too, given Robert Q. Lewis replaced him.
Seriously, Eubanks wouldn't have been in contention. At that point, Goodson still had a bee in his bonnet over Rhyme and Reason, and wouldn't have considered Eubanks for anything. He got over it a few years later.
Ol' reliable Jim Peck would have been an option, but I'm pretty sure they wanted a more well-known name. To be honest, Kennedy was as good as anyone else they could have had.
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A couple of other gentlemen who had worked for Goodson in the past and might have been good were Alex Trebek and Monty Hall. They both had to go to Vancouver for work (Monty got paid, though. Right?)
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What we don't know, but can only speculate, is that ABC may have been influential in Eubanks getting Trivia Trap in the same way CBS was influential in Monty getting Beat the Clock. Goodson would never have hired Monty of his own free will, given that they were direct business competitors.
Alex may have been too cool (aloof?) to establish a rapport with celebrities, at least that may have been the perception.
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As far as Eubanks goes, you have pretty much accented the points I made in the first statment - it would have to be now, not then - he would have to drop the Mr. Top-40 ramrod announcer style and be casual, and he'd have to let the players and contestants be the focus, not himself, allowing just some occasional "what were you thinking?" facial reactions to odd clues. I think there are some similarities in the style of hosting for Password and Newlywed Game, but Bob's warm interaction skills have never been strong. At least to me, anyway. The one thing that was hardest to reconcile about Eubanks was..even though a Bob developed it, it just sounded strange to hear a "Bob" announced as the star of Password. A lighter game, yes... But enough on that.
As far as G-T host picks, did Mark approve or just reluctantly accept the selection of Bowzer on Match Game/Hollywood Squares Hour? Did being a co-producer limit his say on some things, since Squares was an Orion property? And as much as I like Bob and Ray as performers, what few episodes I saw of The Name's The Same, they seemed uncomfortable in an unscripted situation.
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[quote name=\'chris319\' date=\'Apr 8 2005, 10:01 PM\']What we don't know, but can only speculate, is that ABC may have been influential in Eubanks getting Trivia Trap in the same way CBS was influential in Monty getting Beat the Clock. Goodson would never have hired Monty of his own free will, given that they were direct business competitors.
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Eubanks says in his book (or at least the early galley form; I haven't gotten the finished book) that he ran into Goodson's attorney at LAX and asked to audition for Goodson, and got Trivia Trap a few weeks later. It's possible ABC might have made some sort of deal with Hill-Eubanks (that was Bob's production company in the early '80s) that fell through, and ABC gave Eubanks a payoff by having him host Trivia Trap (isn't that more or less how Monty would up on All-New Beat the Clock?). That's the only possible quid pro quo I can think of; Eubanks hadn't hosted anything for ABC since Rhyme and Reason closed shop eight years before.
Eubanks says in the book he would be terrible at hosting Jeopardy; I don't think he'd be especially good at Password, either. It's the sort of game where, if things are going well, the host isn't especially noticeable, and Eubanks has never been the receding type. (Well, maybe his hairline...)
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[quote name=\'Terry K\' date=\'Apr 8 2005, 07:00 PM\']
I really think TK did a good job with P+ and made the show his. Also, he had very big shoes to fill, and he filled them well.
G-T seemed to do an excellent job picking hosts for their creations and revivals.
[/quote]
Yes on both counts...PW+ did indeed have real winners guiding the show in Tom, Allen, and Bill. And up until 1991, G-T/MGP seemed to make bringing back shows effortless, even the short-lived revivals had some merit. If only their successors at Fremantle had the same magic powers...
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[quote name=\'JMFabiano\' date=\'Apr 8 2005, 10:55 PM\']Yes on both counts...PW+ did indeed have real winners guiding the show in Tom, Allen, and Bill. And up until 1991, G-T/MGP seemed to make bringing back shows effortless, even the short-lived revivals had some merit. If only their successors at Fremantle had the same magic powers...
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See that's the thing. Goodson and his associates knew how to tinker with a format and make it work. Shows like the current-day TPIR, Match Game 7x, Password Plus, and to a lesser extent the various '80s revivals all showed that change isn't necessarily a bad thing. However, once Mark died, so did all the creativity. The folks at Fremantle can't seem to change things without messing them up badly, so really, the best advice for them is to play it safe. Hopefully they'll keep that in mind if they ever choose to revive Password.
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I think a lot of it with G-T was they had the clout to pretty much pick their own hosts. They knew the host inventory they had and knew where to place them.
If we look at the hosts that G-T used, they were very hesitant to bring in new hosts unless they *had* to. (Almost all the major hosts have worked for G-T at least once and been pretty good at it)
The 80s gave us several brand new hosts (Combs, Henry, Bowman and Rafferty), of varying quality. After watching Rafferty, he is as I've said is *very* under-rated as a host. I'm watching Eubanks CS now and it seems to drag on and on, Rafferty kept things moving and didn't ramble nearly as much as Eubanks did.
I'm not convinced Eubanks was Mark's first choice for CS. I think that Rafferty would have been better on the daytime version, but with Eubanks doing NG during that era, I'm guessing that was why Rafferty was tapped for the night time version)
Every other host that G-T used in the 80s was someone they'd already used prior.
Even Ross Shafer wasn't *that* bad on MG '90. He had the format down, it was the lousy match-up thing (ABC possibly responsible for!?) I saw a lot of Gene Rayburn in him, he wasn't as fully comfortable with the format as he should or could have been.
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This is somewhat straying from the topic, but I found it interesting that "Blockbusters" on NBC was up against "Card Sharks" on CBS. So Rafferty had to compete against a version of a show he hosted in syndication. Would that fall under irony?
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[quote name=\'aaron sica\' date=\'Apr 8 2005, 07:43 PM\'][quote name=\'Terry K\' date=\'Apr 8 2005, 07:35 PM\']
if you watch the show and see the wide shots, it looks like Ludden is still there. Tom has the same glasses and overall appearance.
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As with most of us, I was a game show fan from a young age. I didn't know who Allen Ludden and Tom Kennedy were until I got a little older, but when I was about 6 1/2 or 7, and watching that show, I remember thinking, "I don't think that's the same guy that they started with..."
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I recall reading a story about Ludden's stroke and not quite knowing what that meant (I was 9 years old at the time) -- but I figured it had something to do with why I saw Tom some months later on the show. I don't recall ever seeing a Cullen episode in first run.
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[quote name=\'Jimmy Owen\' date=\'Apr 9 2005, 09:00 AM\']This is somewhat straying from the topic, but I found it interesting that "Blockbusters" on NBC was up against "Card Sharks" on CBS. So Rafferty had to compete against a version of a show he hosted in syndication. Would that fall under irony?
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[/quote]No, that would fall under coincidence. :-)
Random but on-topic thought: We know CBS and Goodson had to find a new host for CS since Jim Perry was busy with $ale of the Century. Had Jim been available, would he have gotten a look?
ObCS: Anyone else find it odd that the syndicated CS used art cards for the short credit roll while CBS used CGI for the daytime show?
[quote name=\'David Zinkin\' date=\'post count\']Posts: 992[/quote]There's an O'Jays song in there somewhere...
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Two things to further this topic:
FIRST! Allen was in no condition to "hand-pick" anything. Months later, when he was heard but not seen on Hour Magazine that was quite apparent.
SECOND! Oh, just hear Art Fleming as he's plopping down those stairs: "Why, thank you! Thank you, my friends. Thank you, Gene Wood. Thank you so much. Welcome, welcome, welcome and thank you for coming to play our game and welcome to Password Plus, America's favorite game of word communication where our players must identify the password from a one-word clue." You know you'd love it.
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If this has been said already, I apologize for repeating....But I noticed when watching P+ this week, at least on one show, when Tom Kennedy was introduced at the beginning, he said "Hi Allen!", which I thought was a neat gesture..
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[quote name=\'Terry K\' date=\'Apr 9 2005, 08:40 AM\']I'm not convinced Eubanks was Mark's first choice for CS. I think that Rafferty would have been better on the daytime version, but with Eubanks doing NG during that era, I'm guessing that was why Rafferty was tapped for the night time version)
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You might be right. Eubanks had to audition for Card Sharks according to his book, and that was something he hadn't done since the original Newlywed Game.
I would think G-T would have gone back to Perry had he been available. But since Sale of the Century had both a network and syndie version running, he was totally off limits. Thus Bill Rafferty (and I haven't caught anything yet on GSN yet, so I'll have to tape some episodes after the move).
I wonder if either Fleming was more trouble to work with than we think, or production companies so associated him with Jeopardy! that he never got any other offers. Even Allen Ludden, who I gather wasn't always the easiest guy to work with, hosted at least three other shows beside Password, but aside from a single episode of College Bowl, Fleming only did Jeopardy!
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[quote name=\'Terry K\' date=\'Apr 9 2005, 06:40 AM\']After watching Rafferty, he is as I've said is *very* under-rated as a host.[/quote]
Based on his version of Blockbusters, I'd have to strongly disagree with that assessment. Maybe other elements of the show were working against him (as compared to Cullen's version, everything seems inferior - the set is cheaper, the contestants not as bright, etc.), but he just seems grating to me.
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[quote name=\'GS Warehouse\' date=\'Apr 9 2005, 10:18 AM\']ObCS: Anyone else find it odd that the syndicated CS used art cards for the short credit roll while CBS used CGI for the daytime show?
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Yeah, I guess I do find it weird. Same for Blockbusters '87---at least these first few. And here's my Horan moment of the day, but that crawl looked to have been snatched from TPIR, considering the font that they used for the syndicator info.
[quote name=\'Don Howard\']Oh, just hear Art Fleming as he's plopping down those stairs: "Why, thank you! Thank you, my friends. Thank you, Gene Wood. Thank you so much. Welcome, welcome, welcome and thank you for coming to play our game and welcome to Password Plus, America's favorite game of word communication where our players must identify the password from a one-word clue." You know you'd love it.[/quote]
I THINK we may have a Line of the Day here...
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[quote name=\'Jimmy Owen\' date=\'Apr 9 2005, 09:00 AM\']This is somewhat straying from the topic, but I found it interesting that "Blockbusters" on NBC was up against "Card Sharks" on CBS. So Rafferty had to compete against a version of a show he hosted in syndication. Would that fall under irony?
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Or perhaps NBC possibly being spiteful? :-)
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[quote name=\'calliaume\' date=\'Apr 9 2005, 11:27 AM\']
I wonder if either Fleming was more trouble to work with than we think, or production companies so associated him with Jeopardy! that he never got any other offers. Even Allen Ludden, who I gather wasn't always the easiest guy to work with, hosted at least three other shows beside Password, but aside from a single episode of College Bowl, Fleming only did Jeopardy!
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When J! was revived in 84-85, Fleming was reportedly miffed he wasn't contacted about doing it. He was doing a trivia call in show on KMOX in St. Louis for the last few years of his life.
And if you ask me, Trebek does J! just as well as Fleming did. (Of course, Trebek has done it far longer than Fleming ever did!)
As for Ludden, Stumpers was a take on Password, IIRC (It was also a lousy show!), and Liars Club was I think filler until he got P+ back on the air. (of course considering Larry Hovis was behind it!)
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[quote name=\'Terry K\' date=\'Apr 10 2005, 09:38 AM\']As for Ludden, Stumpers was a take on Password, IIRC (It was also a lousy show!), and Liars Club was I think filler until he got P+ back on the air. (of course considering Larry Hovis was behind it!)
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Please. It wasn't filler. It was a job, and he took cause it paid money, not because 'he' was waiting to get P+ back on the air. 'He' didn't have a thing with 'that' either.
Gawd, if 'you' don't know what 'you' are talking about, please 'don't post'.
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[quote name=\'tvwxman\' date=\'Apr 10 2005, 12:11 PM\'][quote name=\'Terry K\' date=\'Apr 10 2005, 09:38 AM\']Liars Club
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Please. It wasn't filler. It was a job, and he took cause it paid money, not because 'he' was waiting to get P+ back on the air. 'He' didn't have a thing with 'that' either.
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Remember we're talking about Ralph ANdrews. Ralph Andrews and "paid money" do not go hand-in-hand
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Fleming did throw a few barbs at the revised Trebek Jeopardy in an article on J! in Sports Illustrated (honest!) back around '88-'89. The writer has Fleming, the then Breckenridge, Colorado saloon keeper, saying the new version is "much too easy", going on to say the prizes were lousy. "Runners up used to keep their prize money. A dollar out of first place and you win a year's supply of lip gloss." As to the glitz, the polish, "It's not part of the real world. It's part of Hollywood." Sour grapes? The show has moved on nicely from it's tacky looking early days. Wonder what Art would say now if he were here?
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I'm guessing in the late 70s that there were some at G-T who blamed Trebek for "Double Dare" bombing, so he didn't have a chance at another job there--at that time.
As for Perry getting his "CS" job back, the understanding I had was that all hands wanted something closer to Bruce Forsyth's take on the format in the UK, which was more of a comedy show. Out of everyone they looked at, Eubanks probably fit the bill the best. Granted, Raferty may've been better, but they may not've looked at him at the time.
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As for Perry getting his "CS" job back, the understanding I had was that all hands wanted something closer to Bruce Forsyth's take on the format in the UK, which was more of a comedy show.
In fact, the original revival plans called for the use of married couples, just as it was played across the pond.
Chuck Donegan (The Illustrious "Chuckie Baby")
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[quote name=\'ChuckNet\' date=\'Apr 12 2005, 11:44 PM\']
As for Perry getting his "CS" job back, the understanding I had was that all hands wanted something closer to Bruce Forsyth's take on the format in the UK, which was more of a comedy show.
In fact, the original revival plans called for the use of married couples, just as it was played across the pond.
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Ah ha! That could explain why Bob was selected for this version of the show. It's well known that he had a rich on-camera history in dealing with couples and perhaps that was the reason he was considered the top candidate.
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[quote name=\'tvwxman\' date=\'Apr 10 2005, 12:11 PM\'][quote name=\'Terry K\' date=\'Apr 10 2005, 09:38 AM\']As for Ludden, Stumpers was a take on Password, IIRC (It was also a lousy show!), and Liars Club was I think filler until he got P+ back on the air. (of course considering Larry Hovis was behind it!)
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Please. It wasn't filler. It was a job, and he took cause it paid money, not because 'he' was waiting to get P+ back on the air. 'He' didn't have a thing with 'that' either.
Gawd, if 'you' don't know what 'you' are talking about, please 'don't post'.
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You said it better than I did. I was getting at the fact that Allen was filling time and getting himself back out there. It didn't hurt that MG was planning a revival of Password, but you totally missed the point.
Some people in this business take jobs to fill time till the next best thing comes along. Ludden took the Liars Club job not necessarily because he needed work, but because he *wanted* work.
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[quote name=\'Terry K\' date=\'Apr 13 2005, 10:50 AM\'][quote name=\'tvwxman\' date=\'Apr 10 2005, 12:11 PM\'][quote name=\'Terry K\' date=\'Apr 10 2005, 09:38 AM\']As for Ludden, Stumpers was a take on Password, IIRC (It was also a lousy show!), and Liars Club was I think filler until he got P+ back on the air. (of course considering Larry Hovis was behind it!)
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Please. It wasn't filler. It was a job, and he took cause it paid money, not because 'he' was waiting to get P+ back on the air. 'He' didn't have a thing with 'that' either.
Gawd, if 'you' don't know what 'you' are talking about, please 'don't post'.
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You said it better than I did. I was getting at the fact that Allen was filling time and getting himself back out there. It didn't hurt that MG was planning a revival of Password, but you totally missed the point.
Some people in this business take jobs to fill time till the next best thing comes along. Ludden took the Liars Club job not necessarily because he needed work, but because he *wanted* work.
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No, I think you're STILL missing the point. Do you know for a fact that MG was planning a revival of Password in 77 when he took Liars Club? If you have privy to such knowledge, please share. Otherwise, you are speculating, and DON'T know what you are talking about (see above criticism.)
Are you in this business? Cause I don't think you are. So don't suggest that you get Ludden's karma....cause I don't think you do.
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Some people in this business take jobs to fill time till the next best thing comes along. Ludden took the Liars Club job not necessarily because he needed work, but because he *wanted* work.
Allen Ludden was not in demand as a game show emcee (or anything else for that matter). Like everyone who works for a living, TV personalities included, it was in his best interest to accept whatever employment was offered him.
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[quote name=\'chris319\' date=\'Apr 13 2005, 05:12 PM\']Allen Ludden was not in demand as a game show emcee (or anything else for that matter). [/quote]
Do you say this because its fact; or because you seemingly didn't get along with him?
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[quote name=\'Modor\' date=\'Apr 13 2005, 02:14 PM\'][quote name=\'chris319\' date=\'Apr 13 2005, 05:12 PM\']Allen Ludden was not in demand as a game show emcee (or anything else for that matter). [/quote]
Do you say this because its fact; or because you seemingly didn't get along with him?
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Use your head, Mark. Outside of Password and the early days of College Bowl, Allen's game show credentials were meager. Can you name any producers or networks who were eager for his services the way they were for Bill Cullen's or Tom Kennedy's?
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[quote name=\'chris319\' date=\'Apr 13 2005, 05:36 PM\'][quote name=\'Modor\' date=\'Apr 13 2005, 02:14 PM\'][quote name=\'chris319\' date=\'Apr 13 2005, 05:12 PM\']Allen Ludden was not in demand as a game show emcee (or anything else for that matter). [/quote]
Do you say this because its fact; or because you seemingly didn't get along with him?
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Use your head, Mark. Outside of Password and the early days of College Bowl, Allen's game show credentials were meager. Can you name any producers or networks who were eager for his services the way they were for Bill Cullen's or Tom Kennedy's?
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Chris is right; other than Password and College Bowl, he did Stumpers, Liar's Club, and Win With the Stars. Packagers: Lin Bolen, Ralph Andrews, and Stuart Phelps-Jesse Martin -- none of whom are among the top five game show packagers.
Allen was good at handling Password, but if you do the same thing 250 or more times a year for 10 years, you're bound to get it down sooner or later. Further, when it's the standard format and not Password Plus/Super Password, it's one of the easiest formats in the world - hand out word packets, announce whose turn it is, count down from 10, repeat. Hell, I hosted Password three times on my college local-access station and the format was never a problem. (However, since I tended to babble, had a wardrobe courtesy of The Salvation Army, a haircut inspired by Duran Duran and a barely visible mustache, I haven't watched the one surviving tape for a long, long time.)
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[quote name=\'calliaume\' date=\'Apr 13 2005, 07:14 PM\']a haircut inspired by Duran Duran and a barely visible mustache, I haven't watched the one surviving tape for a long, long time.)
[/quote]
I, for one, am tiring of the Duran Duran prejudice on this forum.
That said, even THEY didn't try to do that with facial hair. Kudos. :)
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[quote name=\'Don Howard\' date=\'Apr 13 2005, 08:54 AM\'][quote name=\'ChuckNet\' date=\'Apr 12 2005, 11:44 PM\']
As for Perry getting his "CS" job back, the understanding I had was that all hands wanted something closer to Bruce Forsyth's take on the format in the UK, which was more of a comedy show.
In fact, the original revival plans called for the use of married couples, just as it was played across the pond.
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Ah ha! That could explain why Bob was selected for this version of the show. It's well known that he had a rich on-camera history in dealing with couples and perhaps that was the reason he was considered the top candidate.
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And to the person who got it back to the CS we know and love, A) Thank you and B) WHERE IN THE BLUE HELL WERE YOU IN 2001?!!?
I do have one episode of Play Your Cards Right in my collection, aside from the couples and the "sing along with Bruce" cathcphrases it seemed pretty much the same to me.
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[quote name=\'Modor\' date=\'Apr 13 2005, 06:14 PM\'][quote name=\'chris319\' date=\'Apr 13 2005, 05:12 PM\']Allen Ludden was not in demand as a game show emcee (or anything else for that matter). [/quote]Do you say this because its fact; or because you seemingly didn't get along with him?[/quote]
It's a pretty open secret that Ludden was...let's say "not beloved' by most of the people who worked around him at ANY level.
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[quote name=\'Matt Ottinger\' date=\'Apr 14 2005, 06:37 PM\']It's a pretty open secret that Ludden was...let's say "not beloved' by most of the people who worked around him at ANY level.
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Why did Ludden leave (or get the boot from) Liar's Club? It was syndicated, so he could have done P+ at the same time.
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[quote name=\'Neumms\' date=\'Apr 15 2005, 12:12 AM\']Why did Ludden leave (or get the boot from) Liar's Club? It was syndicated, so he could have done P+ at the same time.
[/quote]
If I remember what I learned in Game Show 101 correctly; Liar's Club was cancelled in or around September 1978, freeing him to do P+.
It was Bill Armstrong that got axed from Liar's.
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[quote name=\'Modor\' date=\'Apr 15 2005, 01:18 AM\'][quote name=\'Neumms\' date=\'Apr 15 2005, 12:12 AM\']Why did Ludden leave (or get the boot from) Liar's Club? It was syndicated, so he could have done P+ at the same time.
[/quote]
If I remember what I learned in Game Show 101 correctly; Liar's Club was cancelled in or around September 1978, freeing him to do P+.
It was Bill Armstrong that got axed from Liar's.
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[/quote]
LC aired through the 1978-79 season, as per the EOTVGS. THey could have finished taping LC for the 1978-79 season before tapings of P+ began in 12/78, as syndicated shows in those days were often finished taping for the season before the NATPE convention was held.
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[quote name=\'Modor\' date=\'Apr 15 2005, 01:18 AM\']It was Bill Armstrong that got axed from Liar's.
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[/quote]
Ooops! Thanks for the correction. Why did they ax Bill Armstrong? Just because Ludden became available?
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[quote name=\'Neumms\' date=\'Apr 15 2005, 02:51 PM\'][quote name=\'Modor\' date=\'Apr 15 2005, 01:18 AM\']It was Bill Armstrong that got axed from Liar's.
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[/quote]
Ooops! Thanks for the correction. Why did they ax Bill Armstrong? Just because Ludden became available?
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There seemed to be somewhat of a relaunch of that show. When it started in syndication 20th Century-Fox Television distributed it and it seemed to be on very few stations. Channel 20 in Detroit had it. When AL took over, it was distributed by Sandy Frank and had moved from Channel 20 to 50 (which was considered an upgrade.) In NY, the Armstrong eps were on WOR and the Luddens on WCBS.
Though Allen may not have been in demand, he may have been perceived as more of a "name" than Bill Armstrong. I'm pretty sure more stations aired the Ludden version.
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[quote name=\'Jimmy Owen\' date=\'Apr 15 2005, 03:32 PM\']In NY, the Armstrong eps were on WOR and the Luddens on WCBS.
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I honestly don't remember the Luddens being on WCBS. Doesn't mean it didn't happen (the show was the logical successor to the departing To Tell the Truth, but I don't remember it airing there. Might have been either 9 a.m. or late at night.
I can't find it on the old alt.tv.game-shows list, but I seem to remember someone mentioning Armstrong suing after being removed as host; don't know what came of it (if my memory's even right).
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Curt, you are correct about the time slot. LC did succeed TTTT on Channel 2 on 11/14/77, both shows sharing the 9-10 hour with a local talk show with Jeanne Parr. That did not last long. In mid-January of 78, a Jim Nabors talk show succeeded both shows. Nabors lasted until July 78 and was replaced until September with a combo of "The New Truth or Consequences" and the Canadian "Celebrity Cooks" with Bruno Gerussi. Source: my trusty TV Guide collection.
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[quote name=\'Modor\' date=\'Apr 15 2005, 01:18 AM\'][quote name=\'Neumms\' date=\'Apr 15 2005, 12:12 AM\']Why did Ludden leave (or get the boot from) Liar's Club? It was syndicated, so he could have done P+ at the same time.
[/quote]
If I remember what I learned in Game Show 101 correctly; Liar's Club was cancelled in or around September 1978, freeing him to do P+.
It was Bill Armstrong that got axed from Liar's.
[snapback]81987[/snapback]
[/quote]
I normally bow to your knowledge, but ISTR Armstrong served as EP or producer on this show, and as announcer on Boardman's version. If given the choice of himself or Allen Ludden, who would you pick?
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Getting back to Password Plus, I think Tom Kennedy does a lousy job. He constantly slouches over the podium, and his fake sincerity is blatantly obvious. Plus, he apparently doesn't know the rules at all. And the constant kissing up to Allen and Betty is nauseating.
But otherwise he's doing great!
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[quote name=\'Desperado\' date=\'Apr 16 2005, 10:19 AM\']Getting back to Password Plus, I think Tom Kennedy does a lousy job. He constantly slouches over the podium, and his fake sincerity is blatantly obvious. Plus, he apparently doesn't know the rules at all. And the constant kissing up to Allen and Betty is nauseating.
But otherwise he's doing great!
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[/quote]
I think Bert Convy is proving why he had a "Mendoza line" named after him. On SP he is easily confused, and doesn't seem to have much of a grip on the game.
But I digress.......
Tyshaun
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[quote name=\'Desperado\' date=\'Apr 16 2005, 09:19 AM\']Getting back to Password Plus, I think Tom Kennedy does a lousy job. He constantly slouches over the podium, and his fake sincerity is blatantly obvious. Plus, he apparently doesn't know the rules at all. And the constant kissing up to Allen and Betty is nauseating.
But otherwise he's doing great!
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[/quote]
Gawd, I'd love to see a restaurant review from you:
The waiter was rude, he messed up the drink order, the food was served an hour after we ordered and was ice cold...The serving plates hadn't been washed, the steak was rancid and the apple cobbler still had fresh worms in it!
Otherwise, I give it 4 stars.
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tvwxman, seeing as you have no sense of humor, I'll be sure to POINT OUT my jokes in the future.
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[quote name=\'Desperado\' date=\'Apr 16 2005, 12:24 PM\']tvwxman, seeing as you have no sense of humor, I'll be sure to POINT OUT my jokes in the future.
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Relax. I was continuing your humorous thread. Stick to jokes about Pricing games on the moon.
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[quote name=\'Desperado\' date=\'Apr 16 2005, 07:19 AM\']Getting back to Password Plus, I think Tom Kennedy does a lousy job. He constantly slouches over the podium, and his fake sincerity is blatantly obvious. Plus, he apparently doesn't know the rules at all. And the constant kissing up to Allen and Betty is nauseating.
But otherwise he's doing great!
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[/quote]
This was supposed to be another "joke"?
This comedy thing isn't working for you. I hope you still have a day job. Further, I hope it takes up a lot of your potential posting time.
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Hey clemon, I hear someone eBay is auctioning off a piece of toilet paper used by Jim Lange. Why don't you hurry on over there and place your bid?
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Dude, yer lame even when yer trying to be insulting.
Let me give you some free advice: Stop now before you say something that gets you in trouble. Frankly, I could give two tin ones whether you do or not, but you might.
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Thanks for the unsolicited advice. If I get banned, I get banned. I've tried to contribute to these discussions and perhaps have a sense of humor, and I just get a lot of crap in return. So go on and ban me.
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[quote name=\'Desperado\' date=\'Apr 16 2005, 08:45 PM\']and perhaps have a sense of humor[/quote]
What sense of humor?
So go on and ban me.
Are you challenging the mods to do this?
$20 on Matt Ottinger, please.
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[quote name=\'Modor\' date=\'Apr 16 2005, 08:55 PM\'][quote name=\'Desperado\' date=\'Apr 16 2005, 08:45 PM\']and perhaps have a sense of humor[/quote]
What sense of humor?
So go on and ban me.
Are you challenging the mods to do this?
$20 on Matt Ottinger, please.
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[/quote]
Give me $40 on Zink. :)
Doug
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[quote name=\'SRIV94\' date=\'Apr 16 2005, 10:44 PM\'][quote name=\'Modor\' date=\'Apr 16 2005, 08:55 PM\'][quote name=\'Desperado\' date=\'Apr 16 2005, 08:45 PM\']and perhaps have a sense of humor[/quote]
What sense of humor?
So go on and ban me.
Are you challenging the mods to do this?
$20 on Matt Ottinger, please.
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[/quote]
Give me $40 on Zink. :)
Doug
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I bet $20 on myself.
- Pete Rose
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[quote name=\'SRIV94\' date=\'Apr 16 2005, 10:44 PM\'][quote name=\'Modor\' date=\'Apr 16 2005, 08:55 PM\']Are you challenging the mods to do this?
$20 on Matt Ottinger, please.[/quote]
Give me $40 on Zink. :)[/quote]
Someone put me down for $5 on Carol Wayne.
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50 on Eric Newhouse.
Wait, what board am I on again?
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Hey clemon, I hear someone eBay is auctioning off a piece of toilet paper used by Jim Lange.
The sad thing is that some people would actually BID on it.
Hang on, I'm gonna blow my nose, let it dry and then try to sell the tissue on eBay, claiming it's Lange NTT tourney winner Les Gould's "lucky Kleenex" that he kept on his podium...
Chuck Donegan (The Enterprising "Chuckie Baby")
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[quote name=\'hmtriplecrown\' date=\'Apr 16 2005, 10:16 PM\'][snip]
Someone put me down for $5 on Carol Wayne.
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I'll bet $200 on Patrick Wayne at 55:1........OOPS.......pardon me, this isn't the revival of Celebrity Sweepstakes.....my bad. :-P
[ducks and gets the hell outta dodge]
Anywho, I think TK was a better fit than the Rayburn, Marshall, and some of the others mentioned in this thread. If Ludden couldn't do it, then TK was the best fit for it, IMO.
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Ahem...back on the topic (somewhat), I wondered what you all thought of the one day in 1982 when Jack Narz hosted part of a PW+ episode...
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Ahem...back on the topic (somewhat), I wondered what you all thought of the one day in 1982 when Jack Narz hosted part of a PW+ episode...
I thought it was a good thing Tom gave his partner a chance at the puzzle after he missed it on the 5th clue. Watch closely - it appears Jack wasn't aware of that rule.
I'd like to see more of that week...hopefully GSN will keep it on the schedule long enough!
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[quote name=\'dzinkin\' date=\'Apr 16 2005, 11:10 PM\']I bet $20 on myself.
- Pete Rose
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Now, for the next 20 years you have to vehemently deny ever placing that bet, end up write a book saying you DID in fact place the bet and your confession after all of those years should negate everything you bad have ever done/said…and you should be allowed in the Walk...er, Hall of Fame.