The Game Show Forum
The Game Show Forum => The Big Board => Topic started by: TheInquisitiveOne on June 07, 2004, 08:41:35 PM
-
Good evening everyone!
Ever since I have joined this board, an interesting thought has been in the back of my mind.
As viewers, we generally like to see contestants win big prizes, such as a $50,000 car or three cars in one sitting. However, do the contestants really have it good?
Take this, for example: you just lost on Triple Play. Would you be upset because you lost, or more relieved because you do not have to pay the taxes that come with the cars? I would like to see the general consensus of the group here.
As always, responses are more than welcome!
The Inquisitive One
-
[quote name=\'TheInquisitiveOne\' date=\'Jun 7 2004, 05:41 PM\'] Take this, for example: you just lost on Triple Play. Would you be upset because you lost, or more relieved because you do not have to pay the taxes that come with the cars? [/quote]
I can't think of many game show contestants who would have a need to *add* three cars to their driveway. If you wanted a car (or cars), but couldn't handle the taxes, you could easily sell one or two of those cars back to the dealer (or arrange to sell them privately, where you can often make more money), then apply some of the proceeds to pay for the taxes. You could also sell your existing car(s) to aid the cause if you really want three new cars that badly.
There's no need to want to engineer a loss just to avoid a tax burden - or even if you don't like the cars, especially in light of the fact that you can usually work with the dealers that supply the cars to get alternate models
-
[quote name=\'SplitSecond\' date=\'Jun 7 2004, 08:04 PM\'] [quote name=\'TheInquisitiveOne\' date=\'Jun 7 2004, 05:41 PM\'] Take this, for example: you just lost on Triple Play. Would you be upset because you lost, or more relieved because you do not have to pay the taxes that come with the cars? [/quote]
I can't think of many game show contestants who would have a need to *add* three cars to their driveway. If you wanted a car (or cars), but couldn't handle the taxes, you could easily sell one or two of those cars back to the dealer (or arrange to sell them privately, where you can often make more money), then apply some of the proceeds to pay for the taxes. You could also sell your existing car(s) to aid the cause if you really want three new cars that badly.
There's no need to want to engineer a loss just to avoid a tax burden - or even if you don't like the cars, especially in light of the fact that you can usually work with the dealers that supply the cars to get alternate models [/quote]
Funny enough, I was thinking of the same question the other day when Golden Road on TPIR was played for a motorhome. My first thought was : what the heck would I do with a Motorhome, AND a $28000 tax burden on a $70K prize?
Sorry, I can't justify it...yeah, I could sell it cheap ($40-50K) to make $22K after the taxes, but it sure does sound like a lot of work. Like, where would you put it while you were selling it, and WHO is in the market for a motorhome?
Just my two cents.
-
[quote name=\'tvwxman\' date=\'Jun 7 2004, 08:11 PM\']Funny enough, I was thinking of the same question the other day when Golden Road on TPIR was played for a motorhome. My first thought was : what the heck would I do with a Motorhome, AND a $28000 tax burden on a $70K prize?
Sorry, I can't justify it...yeah, I could sell it cheap ($40-50K) to make $22K after the taxes, but it sure does sound like a lot of work. Like, where would you put it while you were selling it, and WHO is in the market for a motorhome?
Just my two cents.[/quote]
(a) See if it fits in your driveway - so what if there's a little weather beating on it? It's a $70,000 never used (except to drive it to your home) motor home being sold for $50,000.
(b) I think there's a market - especially if it's on sale.
The two things that come to my mind are:
One - remember the old 52-day Mediterranean cruise that Dealer's Choice and $100,000 Name That Tune used to give away? Since you can't sell trips, it's either come up with the $3000 in taxes or don't bother.
Two - when Wheel gives away treasury notes, or even savings bonds, they include all of the interest when showing what the prize is worth. (For example, a "$75,000" note is worth only $37,500 if you cash it in immediately.) Can the IRS tax you on the whole amount up front?
-- Don
-
IIRC, if you sell a prize, you are double-taxed: once for the prize, and once for the money generated from the sale of that prize. So you're going to have a tax burden on the $70k motorhome, plus another tax burden on the $50k you sold it for, and between the two you're in a very high tax bracket, making limited profit on the $50k.
-
If we're talking specifically about TPIR, I can't imagine anyone ever deliberately blowing a game -- or being happy that they lost -- just over the tax issue. Why even bother wanting to be on the show?
Still, the tax burden is a HUGE issue, and I'm sure the vast majority of "winners" don't realize just how difficult it will be to deal with it, especially on high-end luxury items that just aren't practical to their lives. Triple Play is an excelent example, as is just about every flashy prize they offer on the prime-time shows.
-
[quote name=\'tvwxman\' date=\'Jun 7 2004, 06:11 PM\'] Funny enough, I was thinking of the same question the other day when Golden Road on TPIR was played for a motorhome. My first thought was : what the heck would I do with a Motorhome, AND a $28000 tax burden on a $70K prize?
Sorry, I can't justify it...yeah, I could sell it cheap ($40-50K) to make $22K after the taxes, but it sure does sound like a lot of work. Like, where would you put it while you were selling it, and WHO is in the market for a motorhome?
Just my two cents. [/quote]
Almost every dealer who supplies vehicles and RVs for game shows will GLADLY buy back a vehicle you've won, even before you take it off the lot. If I could stand to make $25,000 after taxes just by making less than 10 calls to a dealer and my accountant, I'd do it in a heartbeat.
You can often prepare to sell the vehicle privately before you even drive it off the lot. The buyers are usually ecstatic because they're getting a new vehicle at far below the sticker price, and you as a "broker" can stand to make far more than the dealer would be willing to give you.
Besides, the minor headaches associated with turning this profit are FAR easier to deal with than the shame of being nominated for Misplay of the Day by at least ten different people within five seconds of you throwing the game.
-
[quote name=\'parliboy\' date=\'Jun 7 2004, 06:37 PM\'] IIRC, if you sell a prize, you are double-taxed: once for the prize, and once for the money generated from the sale of that prize. So you're going to have a tax burden on the $70k motorhome, plus another tax burden on the $50k you sold it for, and between the two you're in a very high tax bracket, making limited profit on the $50k. [/quote]
So $0 and a telephone from Invention Submission Corporation is preferable to $10-20K and a few extra 1099's next year?
-
[quote name=\'parliboy\' date=\'Jun 7 2004, 09:37 PM\'] IIRC, if you sell a prize, you are double-taxed: once for the prize, and once for the money generated from the sale of that prize. [/quote]
I'm not an expert on taxes, but I seriously doubt this is true.
My understanding has been that if you sold a prize and got a fair-market price on it (i.e. you didn't sell a car to your uncle for a dollar) then you declare that price as the value of the prize and you pay taxes on that amount.
Gee, if only we had somebody on the board who had been on a bunch of game shows and would know stuff like this for sure -- maybe somebody with a really cool voice...
-
[quote name=\'Matt Ottinger\' date=\'Jun 7 2004, 06:11 PM\'] Gee, if only we had somebody on the board who had been on a bunch of game shows and would know stuff like this for sure -- maybe somebody with a really cool voice... [/quote]
Oh you sweet talking devil you! Unless you were looking for Ben Trittle!!
I'm not gonna run the clock with my most excellent accountant for this one, unless somebody can make a good argument to the contrary. Here's how I see it.
It's never bad to have $15,000+ credit at a car dealership. If you can't use it, there's gotta be someone in your life who would show appreciation in the form of cash for your thoughtfullness.
The question of "double taxation" in a non-issue. Do we believe that everybody who sells a personal item (not a business asset) to another person, via e-bay for example, is required to declare the income from those sales? Everybody who ever held a yard sale would be sharing the cellblock with the e-bayers. Unless you are in the business of buying and selling items, such as an antiques dealer, I believe there is only a potential income tax liability if the cost of the item you sold was taken earlier in part or in whole as a tax deduction and/or was being depreciated for tax purposes. In that case, if I bought a $2,000 PC for business use and took a tax deduction and/or was depreciating the PC as business equipment I would have to document its subsequent sale, and it would likely have tax consequences.
But because I don't like the fact that 100% of HP's tech support is overseas, and seems to be entirely in India, I could sell you this lousy HP PC without triggering a taxable event. That's because I bought this PC entirely to look at porn and I am not in the porn industry (despite my namesake). So as I didn't try to claim any portion of this PC as a business expense when I purchased it, its sale is not a taxable event.
The only tax that MAY be applicable in such cases would be sales tax. And that's a whole other area in which I claim no knowledge. But I believe that dodging sales tax was the genesis of that entire business of selling things to your uncle for $1.
We covered most of the following in a previous thread. Fair Market Value only enters the picture when you try to save some tax liability on large prizes. Typically the IRS Form 1099 that you receive from the network or production company states the manufacturer's suggested retail value of a prize. That's the highest price you will ever see attatched to that item. You may declare a lower Fair Market Value based upon sales of identical items in the open marketplace. Be prepared for an audit by having tons of documentation, such as advertisements in which the manufacturer's name and model number are included with the lower sales prices for the item.
Now a question back. Other than tech support issues is there a reason to buy from Dell at a higher price when the PCs from e-machines and all them other names at the big box stores advertise the same hardware specs at a lower price? Is 3.0 Mhz, 512 RAM, 80 Gig the same and equally reliable no matter whose name is on it?
Randy
tvrandywest.com
-
[quote name=\'tvrandywest\' date=\'Jun 7 2004, 10:46 PM\'] Now a question back. Other than tech support issues is there a reason to buy from Dell at a higher price when the PCs from e-machines and all them other names at the big box stores advertise the same hardware specs at a lower price? Is 3.0 Mhz, 512 RAM, 80 Gig the same and equally reliable no matter whose name is on it?
[/quote]
Hopefully I understand the question.....but from my dealings with computers, not only does Dell have excellent tech support, but E-Machines, Compaq, etc., are generally pieces of crap.
-
[quote name=\'Dsmith\' date=\'Jun 8 2004, 12:00 AM\'] Hopefully I understand the question.....but from my dealings with computers, not only does Dell have excellent tech support, but E-Machines, Compaq, etc., are generally pieces of crap. [/quote]
Not when they're free. (Thanks Paranoia!) Four years later, the only replacement part on the Paranoia eMachine is a new hard drive, installed late last year. The old HD likely crapped out as my family never running ScanDisk or defrag after I gave them that PC 2+ years ago.
Based on my past and current experiences, I'm an HP man forever and not just with desktop PCs. Their printers and digital cameras are quality products as well. Vive le Hewlett-Packard!
-
[quote name=\'tvrandywest\' date=\'Jun 7 2004, 11:46 PM\'] Now a question back. Other than tech support issues is there a reason to buy from Dell at a higher price when the PCs from e-machines and all them other names at the big box stores advertise the same hardware specs at a lower price? Is 3.0 Mhz, 512 RAM, 80 Gig the same and equally reliable no matter whose name is on it? [/quote]
Dell all the way for me... it's what we use in my schools and what I recommend to my clients. My schools had good luck with HP when we bought from them -- Dell offered us a lower price this time around, and their tech support has been nothing short of phenomenal on the rare occasions when we need it.
-
[quote name=\'tvrandywest\' date=\'Jun 7 2004, 10:46 PM\']
Oh you sweet talking devil you! Unless you were looking for Ben Trittle!![/quote]
Well, he sure as hell wasn't looking for Zach.
I'm not gonna run the clock with my most excellent accountant for this one, unless somebody can make a good argument to the contrary. Here's how I see it.
It's never bad to have $15,000+ credit at a car dealership. If you can't use it, there's gotta be someone in your life who would show appreciation in the form of cash for your thoughtfullness.
I do admit that I appreciate the idea of selling the credit to avoid the gift limit.
Meanwhile I did some reading before I responded, so that I wouldn't look like more of a jackass than I have already. So mea culpa, courtesy of Sec. 1001
If you sold an item for more than its value (a possiblity given fair market value) you would still be taxed on the difference, though. And for that matter, if you buy something for less than its value, you can be expected to pay up. So whoever you sell it to still has to pay taxes on his or her gain.
Now a question back. Other than tech support issues is there a reason to buy from Dell at a higher price when the PCs from e-machines and all them other names at the big box stores advertise the same hardware specs at a lower price? Is 3.0 Mhz, 512 RAM, 80 Gig the same and equally reliable no matter whose name is on it?
I build my own machines (three cheers for Thermaltake!). That said, when I have used other machines, there's been a clear quality hierarchy for some time now, and Dell really is at the top of the list in my book. I will not dispute the comparisons between Compaqs and crap. And while I don't doubt HP has good external peripherals (though based on current ink technology I'd go with Epson for non-laser), their computer systems are middle-of-the-road IMO.
The advertised specs are the same between computers, it's true. But I wouldn't buy computer gear based on advertised specs any more than you would buy microphones and headphones based on them. (In fact, I remember people expressing clear brand loyalties on that particular subject previously.)
That 80 Gig drive -- is it 5400 RPM or 7200? That 512 Meg of Ram, what speed is it? What brand is the memory? What about the specs you didn't list? ?What about the motherboard? Separate peripheral cards, or integrated audio and video and lan; and if integrated, what's the CPU usage when activating them? Are the components friendly to overclocking? Are any of the parts proprietary, thereby lowering the usable life of the computer down the road? Etc, etc. And yeah, like you said, the tech support is a cost factor as well.
Then again, I'm my own tech support, so screw all of them.
On a completely unrelated note of my own, I just want to say that VoIP service really, really rocks. Just wanted to say that.
-
[quote name=\'parliboy\' date=\'Jun 7 2004, 09:21 PM\'] If you sold an item for more than its value (a possiblity given fair market value) you would still be taxed on the difference, though. And for that matter, if you buy something for less than its value, you can be expected to pay up. So whoever you sell it to still has to pay taxes on his or her gain. [/quote]
Pardon my density, it's late. Is this contrary to what I believe and posted? If so, I'll happily use my CPA as a "phone-a-friend" ;-)
The advertised specs are the same between computers, it's true. But I wouldn't buy computer gear based on advertised specs any more than you would buy microphones and headphones based on them. (In fact, I remember people expressing clear brand loyalties on that particular subject previously.)
Indeed!
That 80 Gig drive -- is it 5400 RPM or 7200? That 512 Meg of Ram, what speed is it? What brand is the memory? What about the specs you didn't list? ?What about the motherboard? Separate peripheral cards, or integrated audio and video and lan; and if integrated, what's the CPU usage when activating them? Are the components friendly to overclocking? Are any of the parts proprietary, thereby lowering the usable life of the computer down the road? Etc, etc. And yeah, like you said, the tech support is a cost factor as well.
I'd try to answer if I understood the questions!
Then again, I'm my own tech support, so screw all of them.
I'm so jealous!
So, dense as I am tonight, I guess my next move is to call Dell and feel confident that spending that extra $300+ over the cost of the no-name PC with similar sounding specs is a wise investment. Many thanks!
Randy
tvrandywest.com
-
[quote name=\'tvrandywest\' date=\'Jun 7 2004, 08:46 PM\'] Now a question back. Other than tech support issues is there a reason to buy from Dell at a higher price when the PCs from e-machines and all them other names at the big box stores advertise the same hardware specs at a lower price? Is 3.0 Mhz, 512 RAM, 80 Gig the same and equally reliable no matter whose name is on it?
[/quote]
First off, there is "e-machine", and there is "all the other names".
I understand the quality has improved a little from when they first came on the scene, but taking nothing away from Klaussie, I'm of the opinion that e-machines are piles of Grade A Crappe.
Now, for what you want (Web, word processing, maybe some A/V editing, and pr0n), I doubt you'll need high-end 3D stuff, but the e-machine folks use cheaper parts that might not have very good driver support. Most of the Compaqs and Dells and HP machines at the big-box stores don't have that problem, and those are just fine.
-
Now a question back. Other than tech support issues is there a reason to buy from Dell at a higher price when the PCs from e-machines and all them other names at the big box stores advertise the same hardware specs at a lower price? Is 3.0 Mhz, 512 RAM, 80 Gig the same and equally reliable no matter whose name is on it?
Well, sometimes computer companies will ask for from vendors, or will produce "water down", inferior hardware just to say that the mentioned hardware is in their system, mainly to turn a higher profit. Of course, the only real way that I've heard of to combat this problem is to build your own computer, or dig for a small Mom & Pop computer company that advertises that none of there hardware is "watered down", or something along those lines.
But, if you don't feel like going through that hassle...
From personal experience, as for hardware, Dell machines have given me the less number of headaches, while anything from HP or Compaq tends to make my brain explode in anguish and horror.
At the Compaq machine that I'm sitting at now, I've had to replace:Among other components that I cannot think of right now.
As for HP, I have had some problems much similar to the problems I'm having/I have had with my Compaq machine. Dell machines have operated real well for me, though. As stated before, I've had less headaches overall. If you don't feel like building a machine, or getting a smaller company or somebody else to build it for you, I say go with Dell.
-
Is it true that you have the option of turning down a merchandise prize if you want to improve your tax situation, with the understanding that you're not getting another prize in its place ("Prize winners must meet eligibility requirements and win only announced prizes")? It seems to me that it is the other choice than keeping it or donating it to charity, but that was also some years ago.
(The charity donation was something you would consider doing with the year's supply of Rice-a-Roni, the easy side dish you sautee and simmer for flavor perfection--Rice-a-Roni, the San Francisco Treat!--unless you really couldn't afford going to the grocery store.)
-
[quote name=\'uncamark\' date=\'Jun 8 2004, 02:44 PM\'] Is it true that you have the option of turning down a merchandise prize if you want to improve your tax situation, with the understanding that you're not getting another prize in its place [/quote]
Yes, that much I can say with some certainty. After your appearance, you can decline any prize you might have won. You don't get anything in its place, but you don't have to declare it as income either.
-
[quote name=\'uncamark\' date=\'Jun 8 2004, 10:44 AM\'] Rice-a-Roni, the easy side dish you sautee and simmer for flavor perfection--Rice-a-Roni, the San Francisco Treat! [/quote]
Damn good!! I can see a new thread any moment now of fee plugs we all know and love.
OK, a lotta business here. First, THANKS for the PC advice. I'm happily surprised to hear there is pretty widespread consensus on any one hypothesis, and that is about Dell making a superior product. My only clue was that I had it on pretty good authority that Microsoft tests their software using Dells. And I do understand the "watered down" concept of components that are of lesser quality, yet still allow the superior specs to be quoted. I appreciate the education.
Secondly, yes, a contestant has only one option with a prize and that is to forfeit it outright. I kept $100 worth of Raisinettes and Goobers because I found out that I would receive coupons good at retailers as opposed to a dumptruck full of enough candy to send half of LA into a diabetic coma. On the other hand, boxes of Alpine Apple Cider Mix are still in the closet awaiting the next natural disaster. I ultimately learned to forfeit most of the small stuff for which I didn't have a direct use.
I threw a billable hour to my CPA who came back with a definitive answer on the tax question, and it appears to be different than all of our conjecture. Here's the righteous poop:
Fair Market Value is what unrelated parties will pay for an item in the open marketplace. My guy says don't be afraid to use it on the large prizes you may win, such as a motorhome, if you can find some good substantiation for the value you claim. That value, like the value of all prizes, is declared as regular income.
If I can sell a personal asset (not a business asset - something either won on a game show, purchased at a garage sale, or simply lying around the house) at a profit - everybody on e-bay, listen up - by the letter of the law I am required to report any profit on that item. But it is not reported as income, it is reported as a capital gain. (Capital gains are generally taxed at a far lower rate than ordinary income).
Curiously, the IRS will not allow you to claim a capital loss for an item you bought at $100 but were only able to sell for $90. In this kind of transaction gains are taxable, but losses may not be used to offset gains from sales that were profitable. You can use other kinds of capital losses (stock transactions, etc.) to offset the capital gains from these kinds of e-bay (non-business) profitable sales. If you buy and sell crap as a business, even if it is not your primary business, different rules apply and the business gains and/or losses are reported on Schedule C. But that's a whole other can o' crap than the personal tax implications we were talking about.
Going back to one of the original thoughts, no. I don't think it ever makes sense to blow a game on purpose to avoid paying tax on a prize. You can always make the decision to forfeit the prize later. But I guess saying you blew the game on purpose to avoid a tax liability does give you an excuse when trying to explain to a novice why you lost on national TV.
Randy
tvrandywest.com
-
[quote name=\'clemon79\' date=\'Jun 8 2004, 02:21 AM\'] First off, there is "e-machine", and there is "all the other names".
I understand the quality has improved a little from when they first came on the scene, but taking nothing away from Klaussie, I'm of the opinion that e-machines are piles of Grade A Crappe. [/quote]
I don't disagree with your assessment of eMachines. The general opinion at the office the Monday morning after I won the eMachine was congratulatory followed by "You're getting a piece of crap eMachine?!" For a free machine, it's served us well--2 years of gaming, web page creation, video rendering and 'net surfing for me; 2+ years of Super Collapse, 'net connectivity, and some word processing for my parents and my sister. Apparently I got the one good eMachine in the bunch.
And to make this relevant to the tax portion of this thread, I wasn't given a 1099 for the eMachine. Maybe its value at the time the prize was awarded or by the end of the 2000 calendar year was below the taxable threshold, $599...not that I'm complaining.
-
[quote name=\'hmtriplecrown\' date=\'Jun 8 2004, 12:48 PM\'] For a free machine, it's served us well--2 years of gaming, web page creation, video rendering and 'net surfing for me; 2+ years of Super Collapse, 'net connectivity, and some word processing for my parents and my sister. Apparently I got the one good eMachine in the bunch. [/quote]
More to the point, you're not trying to do anything too terribly complicated with it. The point where you would start to run into trouble is if you were trying to run a high-end 3D game or something along those lines.
Randy, I can confirm that MS uses Dells and only Dells. So, for that matter, does Atari...the machine I am typing on right now is a Dimension 4600.
-
[quote name=\'tvrandywest\' date=\'Jun 8 2004, 02:17 PM\'] I'm happily surprised to hear there is pretty widespread consensus on any one hypothesis, and that is about Dell making a superior product. [/quote]
I'll give another shout out to Dell. I bought my machine about four years ago. The only minor issue I've had with it is a bad DVD drive, which Dell swapped out for me. No problems since. I recently maxed the memory and upgraded from WinME to WinXP...my Dell is workin like it's brand new (thank gawd ME is gone...talk about a piece of crap!).
I don't have the best things to say about Dell tech support, but that's only based on one experience with them. The important thing is...the problem (the DVD) was corrected.
My next purchase will most likely be from Dell, but I think my computer has at least a few more years left in it before it's obsolete.
ITSBRY
itsbry@juno.com
-
I'll also echo the praises of Dell...in the 2+ yrs I've had it, it's been serving me well, and have rarely experienced slowdowns that often beset me on the old Quantex that provided my ATGS access from 96-02.
Chuck Donegan (The Illustrious "Chuckie Baby")
-
Well, I'll be the first to gripe about Dell.
I've had by Dimension 8200 for a couple of years. Sweet-ass-sweet computer. Then I had a problem with it about a month ago.. the hard drive errored. I called Dell and ask them what I could do... this incompetent told me to buy a new hard drive. I was saddened because my thesis was on it, and I forgot to back it up. Knowing that hard drives just don't die in two years, I Googled my problem. Well whadaya know... the problem was easily solvable. I guess the good thing out of this is that I found a cheap, 80 gig drive off of PriceWatch.
But this doesn't end here. About a week ago, I some how got a booting error in Windows. Now, I just knew this was fixable, but it was escaping me on how to do. I call Dell again, and what does incompetent #2 say? Reinstall WindowsXP. I hung up on her in disgust, and figured it out myself. Oh, and don't even THINK about getting a Compaq... it's pure-dee crap.
Lesson to be learned - Know your computer. Dell's technical support is a shadow of what it once was (I associate the move to Bombay with a marked decrease in quality). Dells are the way to go, but they aren't perfect.
Brandon Brooks
-
[quote name=\'Brandon Brooks\' date=\'Jun 8 2004, 06:15 PM\'] Oh, and don't even THINK about getting a Compaq... it's pure-dee crap. [/quote]
<------What he said. Dell's incompetence (I'm going based off of Brandon B.'s statements alone) doesn't hold a candle to Compaq. God knows how many times I've nearly thrown my laptop out the window, after dealing with Compaq tech support (or lack thereof). How about 4 hard drive crashes in as many years? (from time to time, you can find an angry Compaq post in my livejournal lol) The problems have been somewhat resolved since we replaced Win ME (the devil) with Win 98, but now that I'm having spyware problems, I can only guess how long this will last. >:o
ObGameShows: Quicksilver was actually pretty good...as far as Stone-Stanley shows are concerned.
-
[quote name=\'Brandon Brooks\' date=\'Jun 8 2004, 04:15 PM\'] Knowing that hard drives just don't die in two years, I Googled my problem. Well whadaya know... the problem was easily solvable. [/quote]
What was it?
I call Dell again, and what does incompetent #2 say? Reinstall WindowsXP.
I'll be the first to agree that Dell's tech support sucks. But using that as a buiying point doesn't work because EVERYONE'S tech support sucks...they're always going to try to get you to replace the part of restage the whole machine or what not because that is the path of least resistance. HP's or Compaq's isn't gonna be any better. Does EMachine even HAVE phone tech support?
(Atari's tech support is excellent. Too bad we don't make systems.)
Oh, and don't even THINK about getting a Compaq... it's pure-dee crap.
They're better than they were. My laptop is a Compaq and I'm fairly happy with it. Dell's better, tho. But with better comes price. I couldn't afford a Dell laptop at the time.
Lesson to be learned - Know your computer.
Certainly doesn't hurt. And checking out Google or popping online onto IRC and finding a help channel or something will often get you better results than anyone putting the "dot" back into "dot-com".
Dells are the way to go, but they aren't perfect.
Nothing is. It's unfair to blame Dell for an industrywide problem.
-
[quote name=\'clemon79\' date=\'Jun 8 2004, 04:27 PM\'] Does EMachine even HAVE phone tech support? [/quote]
Yes, but not toll-free, and from what I've read here, about the same caliber as every other company's.
-
[quote name=\'clemon79\' date=\'Jun 8 2004, 06:27 PM\'] What was it? [/quote]
My computer would not go past the Dell splash screen. It would just go black. The drive was still spinning, but nothing would happen. Starting it in Safe Mode caused it to hang too. I really did think my hard drive just died because I'd never seen it before.
I'll be the first to agree that Dell's tech support sucks. But using that as a buiying point doesn't work because EVERYONE'S tech support sucks...they're always going to try to get you to replace the part of restage the whole machine or what not because that is the path of least resistance. HP's or Compaq's isn't gonna be any better. Does EMachine even HAVE phone tech support?
Well, I'm not saying everyone's tech support does... I'm just saying Dell's (and Compaq's to a much larger degree) does.
(Atari's tech support is excellent. Too bad we don't make systems.)
Just as long as you all know what you're talking about, that's all I want.
They're better than they were. My laptop is a Compaq and I'm fairly happy with it. Dell's better, tho. But with better comes price. I couldn't afford a Dell laptop at the time.
I would not have bought a Dell two years ago if my Compaq desktop wasn't crap. (My freshman year rooommate had a Compaq laptop he bought around the time I bought my desktop. It completely died on him two years later. He built his own computer.) Whenever I had problems with it, Compaq would do things much worse than Dell, such as refuse to help me. I'm sure things have much improved since the merger.
Certainly doesn't hurt. And checking out Google or popping online onto IRC and finding a help channel or something will often get you better results than anyone putting the "dot" back into "dot-com".
That's true. If I would've thought/had access to another computer, I would've done that immediately in both situations.
Nothing is. It's unfair to blame Dell for an industrywide problem.
Not really blaming, per se. Just don't want the buyer to get lulled into thinking that Dells are perfect. I love my computer--not Dell's technical support.
Brandon Brooks
-
[quote name=\'Brandon Brooks\' date=\'Jun 8 2004, 07:33 PM\'] [quote name=\'clemon79\' date=\'Jun 8 2004, 06:27 PM\'] What was it? [/quote]
My computer would not go past the Dell splash screen. It would just go black. The drive was still spinning, but nothing would happen. Starting it in Safe Mode caused it to hang too. I really did think my hard drive just died because I'd never seen it before.
[/quote]
What was the fix, tho?
-
Since he completely recovered his drive, and he said the problem was easy to fix, my money's on an NT Loader problem. I was doing a dual boot with XP and Mandrake a couple of years back and had problems when I uninstalled Mandrake's loader. Someting went screwy with XP's loader and it had similar symptoms.
-
[quote name=\'clemon79\' date=\'Jun 8 2004, 11:05 PM\'] What was the fix, tho? [/quote]
IIRC, I had to put in the Recovery disk and overwrite some files on the HD. I guess it was a BIOS problem. Took a little while to complete, but was relatively simple.
(I admit that I'm not an expert with computers. But I used to be a computer science major, and my inquisitive nature likes to sometimes fool around with things.)
So, it really infuriated me to find out that I didn't need to buy another hard drive at all.
Since he completely recovered his drive, and he said the problem was easy to fix, my money's on an NT Loader problem. I was doing a dual boot with XP and Mandrake a couple of years back and had problems when I uninstalled Mandrake's loader. Someting went screwy with XP's loader and it had similar symptoms.
I'm almost certain that's what it was.
Brandon Brooks
-
*Jumps on soapbox*
The problem with the tech support of Dell, Compaq, etc. isn't so much the fact that they're bad companies - it's how they are doing it that's the question. If all these companies would actually hire TECHNICIANS, IN THE UNITED STATES, that know what the !@#$! they're doing, instead of hiring people who are reading from a book, their image would look much better.
Instead, they get Habib from Bangalore, India, whose course of action for every problem is to "reinstall WindowsXP". Display bad? Reinstall WindowsXP. "r" key not working? Reinstall WindowsXP.
As someone who lost his job to outsourcing back in March, this is a subject that normally quiet Aaron is very outspoken and vocal about.
I hope Earthlink crashes and burns in hell because letting their US support go was the worst thing they ever did.
*Jumps off soapbox*
OBGameShow (stretching it once again): The show "EcoChallenge" in 2002 had a "TeamEarthlink".
-
[quote name=\'Brandon Brooks\' date=\'Jun 8 2004, 06:15 PM\']I called Dell and ask them what I could do... this incompetent told me to buy a new hard drive.
I call Dell again, and what does incompetent #2 say? Reinstall WindowsXP. I hung up on her in disgust, and figured it out myself.[/quote]
This was also my issue with Dell tech support. I knew the problem was the DVD from the start, but the idiot tech support guy had me doing all kinds of stupid stuff. By the time he was done with me, Windows wouldn't even load and I went from having a sometimes not functional DVD to a PC that wouldn't even load Windows.
He tried to get me to reinstall Windows and when I wouldn't do that, he tried to tell me I had a virus, which is tech talk for "I don't know what I'm talking about, but I'll tell the stupid consumer that because they probably don't know any better."
After repeated games of phone tag with the guy, I gave up and called again. I spoke to another tech and bitched until they sent me a new DVD drive. Once I installed it...voila, no more problems.
ITSBRY
itsbry@juno.com
-
[quote name=\'Brandon Brooks\' date=\'Jun 8 2004, 06:15 PM\'] Well, I'll be the first to gripe about Dell.
I've had by Dimension 8200 for a couple of years. (snip) Knowing that hard drives just don't die in two years, I Googled my problem. (snip) [/quote]
Actually hard drives can and do die that quickly. :) At work, we use Dell machines exclusively (and I also have Dell machines at home), and I've had the hard drive replaced in my work PC twice in 2 years. (Once after 3 months and once a year after that). Except you usually know when it dies: Click noises, Windows tells you to insert a disk into Drive C (I loved that message), BIOS errors on boot, etc. To be fair, prior to using Dell machines we used HP at work, and hard drives fail in them to. It just happens.
That being said, I've had nothing but good luck with the Dell machines I have at home. One is pretty heavily used as my homebrew TiVo.
For the record, I have a Dimension 8100, Dimension 8200, Dimension 2400 and Inspiron 2650. (Four computers isn't enough for 1 person!) :)
Straying back to the topic a bit, if I went on TPIR and won a new computer system and armoire, I'd still take them. :)
-
[quote name=\'aaron sica\' date=\'Jun 9 2004, 08:46 AM\'] *Jumps on soapbox*
The problem with the tech support of Dell, Compaq, etc. isn't so much the fact that they're bad companies - it's how they are doing it that's the question. If all these companies would actually hire TECHNICIANS, IN THE UNITED STATES, that know what the !@#$! they're doing, instead of hiring people who are reading from a book, their image would look much better.
Instead, they get Habib from Bangalore, India, whose course of action for every problem is to "reinstall WindowsXP". Display bad? Reinstall WindowsXP. "r" key not working? Reinstall WindowsXP.
As someone who lost his job to outsourcing back in March, this is a subject that normally quiet Aaron is very outspoken and vocal about.
I hope Earthlink crashes and burns in hell because letting their US support go was the worst thing they ever did.
*Jumps off soapbox*
OBGameShow (stretching it once again): The show "EcoChallenge" in 2002 had a "TeamEarthlink". [/quote]
One of my consulting clients reported to me that when he called Gateway for support, he kept getting people who claimed to be from Texas but had accents that said "India" all the way. The solution? He had to say "I want someone from Canada." Make of that what you will.
I also know firsthand that you don't have to be from Bangalore to suggest "reinstall Windows XP" as the solution for every problem; I won't mention names but I know a few techs right here in the good old USA who do the same thing. Not excusing outsourcing, mind you... just as you don't have to be an AOLer to be a moron, you don't have to be from India to be an incompetent computer tech. :-)
ObComputerAndGameShow: "Click" sucked.
-
[quote name=\'aaron sica\' date=\'Jun 9 2004, 07:46 AM\'] Instead, they get Habib from Bangalore, India, whose course of action for every problem is to "reinstall WindowsXP". Display bad? Reinstall WindowsXP. "r" key not working? Reinstall WindowsXP. [/quote]
It's Story Time, since we're all discussing our computers. :-)
They either tell you to reinsatall your OS or try to swindle you into getting an extended warranty...last summer, when my comp. acted up, they would always tell me that my warranty expired, and that I'd have to pay an extra $30 for an extended warranty. Since Compaq couldn't do a reasonable job of fixing my comp. when it WAS under warranty, I refused. I ended up fixing the problem myself by running a FDisk process on my comp.
Also, QuickRestore sucks. :-)
ObGameShow: I *liked* Click.