The Game Show Forum
The Game Show Forum => The Big Board => Topic started by: TLEberle on April 04, 2004, 05:16:20 AM
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I was watching TPIR earlier this week before work. Usually, I'll do something else during the Big Wheel segment, but for some reason, I stuck around to watch, and it was the show with an $11,000 win.
I watched the whole thing happen, and thought to myself that this guy just won $11,000, and he's clapping along like he won a Rascal scooter or something. It's no big deal that he's likely in a new tax bracket. Bob says congratulations, the fanfare dies down, and we're off to the second half of the show.
Did I miss the point where winning $11,000 (a 400:1 shot) suddenly became Not a Big Deal? No "what will you do with the money?" or getting excited about it, it's just move on to the next act.
I've always thought that the Big Wheel is a really dumb way to decide who moves on to the Showcase (even though it does fall into the whole "closest without going over") and it's not going to go away, but that episode cinched the deal for me.
Am I alone here?
Travis Eberle
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The Showcase Showdown exists as a time filler and not much more. It was introduced when the show went from 30 to 60 minutes. With a 1 in 10 chance per show of giving away $1,000 it probably works out to be cheaper than a seventh pricing game. It also makes it a little easier to plan shows as the amount of time allotted to the SS is constant. Perhaps SplitSecond can tell us the exact amount of time allotted.
The phenomenon you describe happened the last time I saw a $1 million win on WWTBAM, so TPIR is not alone in this regard (except that TPIR contestants are more likely to have metal plates in their heads). It was balloons, here's your check, now make your exit.
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[quote name=\'TLEberle\' date=\'Apr 4 2004, 05:16 AM\'] I watched the whole thing happen, and thought to myself that this guy just won $11,000, and he's clapping along like he won a Rascal scooter or something. It's no big deal that he's likely in a new tax bracket. Bob says congratulations, the fanfare dies down, and we're off to the second half of the show.
Did I miss the point where winning $11,000 (a 400:1 shot) suddenly became Not a Big Deal? No "what will you do with the money?" or getting excited about it, it's just move on to the next act.
I've always thought that the Big Wheel is a really dumb way to decide who moves on to the Showcase (even though it does fall into the whole "closest without going over") and it's not going to go away, but that episode cinched the deal for me. [/quote]
Man, where to start...
1) Some people just aren't as demonstrative as others. Maybe he wanted to look "cool" on television. Besides, when you get right down to it, $11K is a lovely windfall, but for most people not a life-changing sum. It's also not about the money. Champs win at least that much just about every day on Jeopardy, and NONE of them jump up and down.
2) In almost 30 years, I can never remember Bob stopping the game after an $11K win and asking what the player will do with the money. It also doesn't surprise me at all that BOB doesn't get excited about it anymore. It's just a random thing, and he's seen hundreds of them.
3) All things considered, the Big Wheel was a *brilliant* addition to the game, probably the best single thing they ever came up with. It may have only been designed as time filler, but it was ingenious nonetheless.
Bottom line is that some contestants will show excitement, some won't. This one guy on this one episode didn't. Not that big a deal.
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[quote name=\'TLEberle\' date=\'Apr 4 2004, 04:16 AM\'] I was watching TPIR earlier this week before work. Usually, I'll do something else during the Big Wheel segment, but for some reason, I stuck around to watch, and it was the show with an $11,000 win.
I watched the whole thing happen, and thought to myself that this guy just won $11,000, and he's clapping along like he won a Rascal scooter or something. It's no big deal that he's likely in a new tax bracket. Bob says congratulations, the fanfare dies down, and we're off to the second half of the show.
Did I miss the point where winning $11,000 (a 400:1 shot) suddenly became Not a Big Deal? No "what will you do with the money?" or getting excited about it, it's just move on to the next act.
I've always thought that the Big Wheel is a really dumb way to decide who moves on to the Showcase (even though it does fall into the whole "closest without going over") and it's not going to go away, but that episode cinched the deal for me.
Am I alone here?
Travis Eberle [/quote]
It's probably the same kind of person that posts on this board and says: "They only give away $25,000 on Pyramid. How cheap! They gave that much away in 1975."
$11,000 sure would go aways towards college....
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[quote name=\'Dsmith\' date=\'Apr 4 2004, 11:59 AM\'] It's probably the same kind of person that posts on this board and says: "They only give away $25,000 on Pyramid. How cheap! They gave that much away in 1975."
$11,000 sure would go aways towards college.... [/quote]
And some of it would make a nice down payment on a new car.
The way I figure it, sure $11,000 isn't as much as when they initiated the bonus spin rule in the 70s (And no, I don't care to know the exact year it came about), but just how much $$$ did these contestants walk in with?
BTW, most unemotional contestant award goes to those on Pyramid, with the exception of Jeremy Soria. :-)
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By the way, according to this weekend's page in the 2004 Jump The Shark calendar, the authors of the calendar pages determined that the fins started circling when the Showcase Showdown wheel was added in the mid-1980s (that's the decade they cited) but jumped officially when Bob allowed his gray hair to be shown.
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I've never seen a written account of how much time is allotted for the Showcase Showdown, but it occurs so late in each half-hour that it becomes the accordion act - that is, Barker tries to squeeze it tight or expand it in order to take up the proper amount of time on a show-by-show basis, to help the show end exactly at the half-hour break and at the end of the hour. That's why sometimes Barker will just come back and usher a contestant to the wheel in the first Showdown, and then give the full rules explanation and explain each contestant's handmade t-shirt in the second.
Other acts are slightly accordionized so that this "responsibility" doesn't totally fall on the wheel - pricing games 4 and 6, plus the showcases, for instance.
The Big Wheel may be dumb to you and me, Travis, but the genius of it is that it's an experience, like the Plinko board, that the average person cannot recreate at home. People go ga-ga over Plinko because they can't simulate the real thing in their living rooms, while you could ask the average person on the street to describe It's in the Bag - a far better game, in my opinion - and you're gonna get a lot of blank stares and maybe a few smart-aleck comments about Rolf Benirschke.
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[quote name=\'TLEberle\' date=\'Apr 4 2004, 02:16 AM\'] Did I miss the point where winning $11,000 (a 400:1 shot) suddenly became Not a Big Deal?
[/quote]
Two thoughts about the $10,000:
1) We have seen game shows where you take home $32,000 for LOSING (Millionaire), and we have seen game shows where you win $100K OR MORE for answering two only-moderately-difficult multiple-choice questions (21). This is the aftermath of Mo Money Syndrome. Enjoy it, folks.
2) I'm not saying TPiR is guilty of this, but this is the kind of behavior you should expect in the future when game show coordinators are casting Good-Looking Twentysomethings instead of people who genuinely would enjoy being on a game show.
I've always thought that the Big Wheel is a really dumb way to decide who moves on to the Showcase
Riddle me this, though: would you prefer a playoff system where each contestant gets an equal chance at the Showcase, or would you prefer the old system, where you can win your game and still have no chance of going because someone else won a game and had the good fortune to play for a bigger prize than you did?
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[quote name=\'clemon79\' date=\'Apr 4 2004, 02:31 PM\']
Riddle me this, though: would you prefer a playoff system where each contestant gets an equal chance at the Showcase, or would you prefer the old system, where you can win your game and still have no chance of going because someone else won a game and had the good fortune to play for a bigger prize than you did? [/quote]
The pre-SCSD(and 70s and 80s syndie versions) system for who makes the showcase was flawed for that reason, at least when the total take in the third PG was less than what the first two players won for winning their PGs.
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Chris, you present a dilemma: the more fair Big Wheel, or having the top winners move on. Frankly, neither of those is very appealing. I think that another one-bid, or one-bids until someone wins twice, would make sense, because it has more to do with the pricing of items than spinning a wheel.
But I know the wheel isn't going anywhere, so I'll continue to use the SS as "extra" time, like if I need to take a shower before work. I'm usually done by the time the fourth one-bid price is revealed.
Travis
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[quote name=\'zachhoran\' date=\'Apr 4 2004, 04:30 PM\'] [quote name=\'clemon79\' date=\'Apr 4 2004, 02:31 PM\']
Riddle me this, though: would you prefer a playoff system where each contestant gets an equal chance at the Showcase, or would you prefer the old system, where you can win your game and still have no chance of going because someone else won a game and had the good fortune to play for a bigger prize than you did? [/quote]
The pre-SCSD(and 70s and 80s syndie versions) system for who makes the showcase was flawed for that reason, at least when the total take in the third PG was less than what the first two players won for winning their PGs. [/quote]
PJTP. I just SAID that.
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[quote name=\'TLEberle\' date=\'Apr 4 2004, 11:12 PM\'] Chris, you present a dilemma: the more fair Big Wheel, or having the top winners move on. Frankly, neither of those is very appealing. I think that another one-bid, or one-bids until someone wins twice, would make sense, because it has more to do with the pricing of items than spinning a wheel. [/quote]
I think the bigger question is: A *fairer* game or a *funner* game? (Pardon my grammar...) If all TPIR wanted to be was a test of people's pricing skills, a fairer game they could do in the allotted time would probably be a blind one-bid (everybody writes down bids for an item, closest without going over plays the showcase).
But TPIR is a game show. The Big Wheel is more entertaining, and it covers the whole fairness thing by giving a modest but not insurmountable advantage to the players with the higher totals. If the randomness of the wheel isn't your cup of tea, then sure, use that time in some other pursuit. But to most folks, it's fun.
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Just to throw in my two cents:
I personally find the SCSD boring. Why? Because there's little to no play-along factor for the viewer. In every other game I can participate from home, yelling, "Pick the Little Debbies, you idiot! It's the only price that ends in zero, so there's sure to be a 10 back there." With the Big Wheel, all I get to do is watch a bunch of people spin a wheel. At best I can second-guess their decisions as to whether or not to spin again.
Nevertheless, I know that the Big Wheel is one of the most recognizable symbols of TPIR to the general public, most of whom don't even remember a time when there was no wheel (let alone when the show was only 30 minutes long). In playing the TPIR home games with people, invariably they've asked me where the Big Wheel is. No one has yet asked me where "It's in the Bag" is.
It's no coincidence that the MDS have used the Big Wheel as the vehicle to give away the million smackers. Face it: People know and like the wheel.
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[quote name=\'Mike Tennant\' date=\'Apr 5 2004, 01:42 PM\'] It's no coincidence that the MDS have used the Big Wheel as the vehicle to give away the million smackers. Face it: People know and like the wheel. [/quote]
How else could they try to give away the million randomly?
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[quote name=\'cmjb13\' date=\'Apr 5 2004, 12:53 PM\'] [quote name=\'Mike Tennant\' date=\'Apr 5 2004, 01:42 PM\'] It's no coincidence that the MDS have used the Big Wheel as the vehicle to give away the million smackers. Face it: People know and like the wheel. [/quote]
How else could they try to give away the million randomly? [/quote]
Big Bucks! Big Bucks! STOP!
(foghorn)
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[quote name=\'Mike Tennant\' date=\'Apr 5 2004, 11:42 AM\'] Just to throw in my two cents:
I personally find the SCSD boring. Why? Because there's little to no play-along factor for the viewer. In every other game I can participate from home, yelling, "Pick the Little Debbies, you idiot! It's the only price that ends in zero, so there's sure to be a 10 back there." With the Big Wheel, all I get to do is watch a bunch of people spin a wheel. At best I can second-guess their decisions as to whether or not to spin again.
Nevertheless, I know that the Big Wheel is one of the most recognizable symbols of TPIR to the general public, most of whom don't even remember a time when there was no wheel (let alone when the show was only 30 minutes long). In playing the TPIR home games with people, invariably they've asked me where the Big Wheel is. No one has yet asked me where "It's in the Bag" is.
It's no coincidence that the MDS have used the Big Wheel as the vehicle to give away the million smackers. Face it: People know and like the wheel. [/quote]
Second-guessing that decision, IMHO, is no small thing. It gives it more play-along factor than some pricing games. (The Race Game comes to mind, because you can't run back and forth yourself. Temptation has no play-along for me, because with only 1 chance in 16 of winning the car, I almost always take the four prizes, especially if one of them is cash.)
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[quote name=\'zachhoran\' date=\'Apr 4 2004, 06:30 PM\'] The pre-SCSD(and 70s and 80s syndie versions) system for who makes the showcase was flawed for that reason, at least when the total take in the third PG was less than what the first two players won for winning their PGs. [/quote]
....and then there was the original way the 1994 version decided.....the 3-player playoff of "The Price Was Right"..... ;)
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[quote name=\'EmiOfBrie\' date=\'Apr 6 2004, 08:33 AM\'] [quote name=\'zachhoran\' date=\'Apr 4 2004, 06:30 PM\'] The pre-SCSD(and 70s and 80s syndie versions) system for who makes the showcase was flawed for that reason, at least when the total take in the third PG was less than what the first two players won for winning their PGs. [/quote]
....and then there was the original way the 1994 version decided.....the 3-player playoff of "The Price Was Right"..... ;) [/quote]
As per Tony Harrison's TPIR site, the reason the Big Wheel was even used on some episodes of TNPIR94 was that they only got clearance for about 50 retromercials for the Price WAS Right segments(there were 65 episodes made of TNPIR94).
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[quote name=\'Jay Temple\' date=\'Apr 5 2004, 11:58 PM\'][quote name=\'Mike Tennant\' date=\'Apr 5 2004, 11:42 AM\']With the Big Wheel, all I get to do is watch a bunch of people spin a wheel. At best I can second-guess their decisions as to whether or not to spin again.[/quote]
Second-guessing that decision, IMHO, is no small thing. It gives it more play-along factor than some pricing games. (The Race Game comes to mind, because you can't run back and forth yourself. Temptation has no play-along for me, because with only 1 chance in 16 of winning the car, I almost always take the four prizes, especially if one of them is cash.)[/quote]
Mike: It might not be everyone's cup of tea, but I like to do what Bob usually does, and figure out what their chances are of taking the lead/getting $1.00 while the wheel is still slowing down.
Jay: I think you're using a different definition of "play-along factor" than the one I usually think of. You don't have to imagine yourself literally in the position of the contestant--you can yell out which two prices she should switch in Race Game, and you can yell out which number in the price of the car is obviously wrong in Temptation.
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[quote name=\'zachhoran\' date=\'Apr 6 2004, 08:36 AM\']As per Tony Harrison's TPIR site, the reason the Big Wheel was even used on some episodes of TNPIR94 was that they only got clearance for about 50 retromercials for the Price WAS Right segments(there were 65 episodes made of TNPIR94).[/quote]
Actually, this is what Tony Harrison's site says:
Interestingly, TNPiR'94 probably would never have used the wheel for the showcase showdown. The reason they had to was because the clip research company that TNPiR used only had finished research on 80 or so clips for The Price Was Right when the show started production. Since they had approximately 100 episodes to do, there had to be some shows where the wheel was used.
Source:
http://www.tpir.tv/newprice/newprice.htm (http://\"http://www.tpir.tv/newprice/newprice.htm\")
I see nothing about clearance for the "retromercials" here.
Zach, what is it going to take to keep you from PJTP?
(Memo to the rest of the group: I know Zach will never care about getting anything right -- PJTP is all he cares about. It's a rhetorical question, asked in the hope that others won't follow his lead.)
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[quote name=\'dzinkin\' date=\'Apr 7 2004, 05:58 PM\'] [quote name=\'zachhoran\' date=\'Apr 6 2004, 08:36 AM\']As per Tony Harrison's TPIR site, the reason the Big Wheel was even used on some episodes of TNPIR94 was that they only got clearance for about 50 retromercials for the Price WAS Right segments(there were 65 episodes made of TNPIR94).[/quote]
Actually, this is what Tony Harrison's site says:
Interestingly, TNPiR'94 probably would never have used the wheel for the showcase showdown. The reason they had to was because the clip research company that TNPiR used only had finished research on 80 or so clips for The Price Was Right when the show started production. Since they had approximately 100 episodes to do, there had to be some shows where the wheel was used.
Source:
http://www.tpir.tv/newprice/newprice.htm (http://\"http://www.tpir.tv/newprice/newprice.htm\")
I see nothing about clearance for the "retromercials" here.
Zach, what is it going to take to keep you from PJTP?
[/quote]
Dave, you should know of all people it takes a lot for me to stop PJTP:)
I remembered what Tony had said, but subsituted in my mind the wrong word.
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[quote name=\'zachhoran\' date=\'Apr 7 2004, 07:11 PM\'] Dave, you should know of all people it takes a lot for me to stop PJTP:) [/quote]
What's sad is that you're proud of this fact.
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[quote name=\'zachhoran\' date=\'Apr 7 2004, 07:11 PM\'] Dave, you should know of all people it takes a lot for me to stop PJTP:)
[/quote]
So you're saying you don't mind posting incorrect facts as well? Not trying to be funny, but I find it extremely weird that you'd go through so much just because you like the sound of your voice, or rather, sight of your name. It's almost troll-like, IMODO.
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[quote name=\'fostergray82\' date=\'Apr 7 2004, 07:24 PM\'] [quote name=\'zachhoran\' date=\'Apr 7 2004, 07:11 PM\'] Dave, you should know of all people it takes a lot for me to stop PJTP:)
[/quote]
So you're saying you don't mind posting incorrect facts as well? Not trying to be funny, but I find it extremely weird that you'd go through so much just because you like the sound of your voice, or rather, sight of your name. It's almost troll-like, IMODO. [/quote]
Explaining myself is so damned difficult, at least for me. I know a lot of you have asked in IM and in e-mail to try to do that.
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[quote name=\'fostergray82\' date=\'Apr 7 2004, 07:24 PM\'] [quote name=\'zachhoran\' date=\'Apr 7 2004, 07:11 PM\'] Dave, you should know of all people it takes a lot for me to stop PJTP:)
[/quote]
So you're saying you don't mind posting incorrect facts as well? Not trying to be funny, but I find it extremely weird that you'd go through so much just because you like the sound of your voice, or rather, sight of your name. It's almost troll-like, IMODO. [/quote]
He's just trying to catch up with Lemon. Zach, don't bother. I know I'm not even going to try!
Geez, that guy got on Millionaire?!
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[quote name=\'Matt Ottinger\' date=\'Apr 4 2004, 11:13 AM\'] 3) All things considered, the Big Wheel was a *brilliant* addition to the game, probably the best single thing they ever came up with. It may have only been designed as time filler, but it was ingenious nonetheless. [/quote]
Brilliant? It's always seemed a little disappointing to me that the two finalists in every show are determined by random selection.
(I know it's not quite random, but there's really not a lot of chance for a player to develop skill, so spinning ability can be pretty much discounted.)
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[quote name=\'clemon79\' date=\'Apr 4 2004, 02:31 PM\'] Riddle me this, though: would you prefer a playoff system where each contestant gets an equal chance at the Showcase, or would you prefer the old system, where you can win your game and still have no chance of going because someone else won a game and had the good fortune to play for a bigger prize than you did? [/quote]
That's the best argument I've heard in favor of the wheel. That said, I'd prefer that all three on-stage winners play some pricing game. But that's not gonna happen, not unless Price goes to an hour-ten format.
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[quote name=\'Clay Zambo\' date=\'Apr 7 2004, 11:52 PM\'] [quote name=\'clemon79\' date=\'Apr 4 2004, 02:31 PM\'] Riddle me this, though: would you prefer a playoff system where each contestant gets an equal chance at the Showcase, or would you prefer the old system, where you can win your game and still have no chance of going because someone else won a game and had the good fortune to play for a bigger prize than you did? [/quote]
That's the best argument I've heard in favor of the wheel. That said, I'd prefer that all three on-stage winners play some pricing game. But that's not gonna happen, not unless Price goes to an hour-ten format. [/quote]
I fail to see what would be wrong with having the 3 contestants do a 1-bid.
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[quote name=\'GS Warehouse\' date=\'Apr 7 2004, 09:07 PM\'] He's just trying to catch up with Lemon. Zach, don't bother. [/quote]
Quality, not quantity.
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I fail to see what would be wrong with having the 3 contestants do a 1-bid.
I personally find it a bit redundant and boring. The Wheel breaks apart the show halves nicely, and is exciting. Gotta go with Matt and the whole "game show argument" here.
-Jason
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[quote name=\'GS Warehouse\' date=\'Apr 7 2004, 11:07 PM\']
Geez, that guy got on Millionaire?! [/quote]
It's that whole statistical outlier thing.
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[quote name=\'tommycharles\' date=\'Apr 8 2004, 12:06 AM\'] I fail to see what would be wrong with having the 3 contestants do a 1-bid. [/quote]
Nothing at all. But it wouldn't be any more interesting than a standard one-bid, even if it were for a mo' 'spensive prize. What makes the wheel work, I guess, is that it's a completely different game. A palate-cleanser, if you will.
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[quote name=\'clemon79\' date=\'Apr 4 2004, 10:36 PM\'] PJTP. I just SAID that. [/quote]
Off-topic; I'm sorry.
What's "PJTP"?
Doltishly yours,
CZ
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[quote name=\'Clay Zambo\' date=\'Apr 8 2004, 09:51 AM\'] [quote name=\'clemon79\' date=\'Apr 4 2004, 10:36 PM\'] PJTP. I just SAID that. [/quote]
Off-topic; I'm sorry.
What's "PJTP"?
Doltishly yours,
CZ [/quote]
PJTP=POsting Just to Post. I'm not sure if someone on this board created it or it was created on another board and appears on other boards like this one.
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[quote name=\'zachhoran\' date=\'Apr 8 2004, 09:58 AM\'] PJTP=Posting Just to Post. I'm not sure if someone on this board created it or it was created on another board and appears on other boards like this one. [/quote]
I'll take that one. It was created by yours truly long ago and far away (approximately two months ago) on this very board.
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[quote name=\'Clay Zambo\' date=\'Apr 8 2004, 07:51 AM\'] What's "PJTP"?
[/quote]
It's what Zach does when he inserts some barely-relevant (if at all) asinine bit of trivia into a discussion, or one of his annoying nitpicks that also have no relevance to the discussion at large, just so he can make sure no one questions his authority as the Greatest Game Show Mind Of Our Time.
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[quote name=\'clemon79\' date=\'Apr 8 2004, 10:15 PM\'] [quote name=\'Clay Zambo\' date=\'Apr 8 2004, 07:51 AM\'] What's "PJTP"?
[/quote]
It's what Zach does when he inserts some barely-relevant (if at all) asinine bit of trivia into a discussion, or one of his annoying nitpicks that also have no relevance to the discussion at large, just so he can make sure no one questions his authority as the Greatest Game Show Mind Of Our Time. [/quote]
We all know Steve Beverly is the Greatest Game SHow Mind of our Time :)
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[quote name=\'zachhoran\' date=\'Apr 8 2004, 10:20 PM\'] [quote name=\'clemon79\' date=\'Apr 8 2004, 10:15 PM\'] [quote name=\'Clay Zambo\' date=\'Apr 8 2004, 07:51 AM\'] What's "PJTP"?
[/quote]
It's what Zach does when he inserts some barely-relevant (if at all) asinine bit of trivia into a discussion, or one of his annoying nitpicks that also have no relevance to the discussion at large, just so he can make sure no one questions his authority as the Greatest Game Show Mind Of Our Time. [/quote]
We all know Steve Beverly is the Greatest Game SHow Mind of our Time :) [/quote]
Hopefully I can say this without getting into too much trouble with the moderators.
Zach, get over yourself. Each time you make an asinine post like this, you lessen what little credibility you may have left. Most of the time, we don't give a damn if John Harlan announced the September 12, 1986 episode of Sale of the Century, nor do we care that AWOR aired "Tattletales" at 5:00 PM. Your inane fandom probably even shocks Mr. Game Show.
Maybe I posted this because I'm sick of the garbage...or it could be that its 3:30.
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Let me say this to Zach in Mr. Game Show terms:
"Dig a hole & crawl in ZH".
Back on track here. I think the Big Wheel is a great equalizer in terms of who gets to go to the Showcases. Granted, the odds of even qualifying there is a mere 3:1, but more othen than not, the 3rd lowest winner of each usually winds up there most of the time anyway.
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[quote name=\'Craig Karlberg\' date=\'Apr 9 2004, 03:48 AM\'] I think the Big Wheel is a great equalizer in terms of who gets to go to the Showcases. Granted, the odds of even qualifying there is a mere 3:1, but more othen than not, the 3rd lowest winner of each usually winds up there most of the time anyway. [/quote]
Really? Then why not have the top winner from each half spin first, if that's the advantageous position.
Without opening a can of statistical worms, how often does the first spinner win at the Wheel?
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[quote name=\'Craig Karlberg\' date=\'Apr 9 2004, 04:48 AM\'] Granted, the odds of even qualifying there is a mere 3:1, but more othen than not, the 3rd lowest winner of each usually winds up there most of the time anyway. [/quote]
This might be a semantic issue. Technically, "third-lowest" would be the one of the three who won the MOST.
However if Craig is saying that the person who spins first is most likely to win, then he is wrong. No matter how it may look to him, the player who spins last has a slight but distinct advantage, and over time, that person is simply going to win more often.
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[quote name=\'Clay Zambo\' date=\'Apr 9 2004, 09:38 AM\'] Without opening a can of statistical worms, how often does the first spinner win at the Wheel? [/quote]
Easy to open when you have a can-opener handy :)
To take a full Season of stats, Season 31's Showcase Showdowns looked like this:
First Spinner Wins: 103
Second Spinner Wins: 129
Third Spinner Wins: 118
However, for Season 32 thusfar:
First Spinner Wins: 79
Second Spinner Wins: 84
Third Spinner Wins: 99
This week past had 5 winners who spun first advance to the Showcase, while only 1 second spinner did so. Only 2 of the 8 contestants who spun third advanced. Certainly there will be weeks like this one. But in the long run, on average, the third spinner will win most often.
Matt is totally correct. I was the Top Winner in the first half, and spun last. I did not even HAVE to spin, because the first two spinners went over. Clearly, I had the advantage.
[quote name=\'Clay Zambo\' date=\'Apr 9 2004, 09:38 AM\']Then why not have the top winner from each half spin first, if that's the advantageous position.[/quote]
TNPiR '94 :)
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It's really interesting to me that over the course of the entire 31st season, it was the SECOND spinner who ended up doing the best. I would have thought that hundreds of attempts would have been enough to settle in to more predictable patterns.
Still, taking ALL the results CGJ gave us, that's:
29.7% First Spinner Wins
34.8% Second Spinner Wins
35.5% Third Spinner Wins
I'm surprised to see the results to be as close as they are, but there again, that takes a little away from the argument that it's unfair for the top money winner to have merely been the one who was lucky enough to play the most valuable game. The advantage you get isn't really huge, and of course you still have to have won your game to have earned it.
In other words, a little luck, a little strategy, a little skill. Pretty much what TPIR is all about.
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It is interesting, Matt.
Season 30 was the same:
First Spinner Wins: 93
Second Spinner Wins: 133
Third Spinner Wins: 124
Although Season 29 followed the statistics:
First spinner wins: 92
Second spinner wins: 115
Third spinner wins: 121
I would agree that strategy has alot to do with it. Did some of the second spinners in fact beat the first spinner, but didn't feel it was enough to make the Showcase, so spun again only to go over? Never know.
With some more help from Scorpz' site, we also know this:
Automatic wins for third spinner - Season 29: 11
Automatic wins for third spinner - Season 30: 11
Automatic wins for third spinner - Season 31: 8
Automatic wins for third spinner - Season 32: 8
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Man, that's just astonishing. With more than three and a half YEARS of results to look at, there appears to be no statistical difference at all between going second or going third. (28% - 36% - 36%)
Apparently, the only real advantage to going third as opposed to second is to not have to be troubled with a strategic decision.
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Worked for me! :)
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You can actually calculate the "optimal" strategy for each player. It's pretty straightforward to calculate it in Excel. The 3rd spinner should spin again if he hasn't won already (or tied on $.45 or less). The 2nd spinner should spin again on $.55 or less. The first spinner should spin again on $.65 or less. Of course, actual contestants don't play optimally, plus you get the occasional person who tries to aim the wheel. The odds don't really change for the MDS - the bonus spin is worth more, but qualifying for the showcase is worth more.
Speaking of the MDS, shouldn't someone who just misses the $1,000,000 get more than $5,000 as a consolation for the green section? This has already happened at least twice, and landing on the green section seemed to be a big disappointment.
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It's probably one of the reasons they made it the $1M gimmick on the prime-time specials now. Make the SSD mean something!!
As for me, maybe put it up to $25K for the bonus dollar, and make it mean something more. Now, it seems that the SSD is only the qualifier, at $10K stakes.
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[quote name=\'Clay Zambo\' date=\'Apr 9 2004, 09:38 AM\'] Really? Then why not have the top winner from each half spin first, if that's the advantageous position.
[/quote]
Which is what the '94 version did, I believe.
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Let me say this to Zach in Mr. Game Show terms:
"Dig a hole & crawl in ZH".
Let me say this in Executive Producer terms: you may find Zach's minutiae posts inane, but he has the right to post them and you don't have the right to bash him for it.