The Game Show Forum
The Game Show Forum => The Big Board => Topic started by: Blanquepage on July 29, 2025, 08:00:28 PM
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Transplanting my original post from Double Talk #1 video to form this thread.
Watching the Double Talk premiere, I find myself thinking about all my shifts in sentiment towards shows and hosts. Seeing this now, despite the clumsy clue readings, Henry was just fine. I'm sure he pulled off episode 1 better than I probably would have hosting the 1st episode of my 1st game show. What sentiments towards shows and hosts have changed for you over the years?
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I still think HP2 is a maladroit TV presence.
Pat Finn is a good if not great host saddled with two formats that we have been unkind to.
Robb Edward Morris and his quiet demeanor goes well with Make the Grade until the Fire Drill.
Phil Moore makes me almost forget what a dog’s dinner of a rule set Nick Arcade had.
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I've always thought that TTD'90's reputation as one of the worst game shows ever was a bit overblown. The core gameplay was still largely unchanged, the doubling square values in the event of a tie compensated adequately for the pot being reset, and Patrick Wayne honestly wasn't that bad of a host--if he had gotten a bit of coaching to tone it down a notch, he would've been fine.
On the flip side of that...while I still enjoy watching the classic TPiR channel (mainly to pay attention to the music cues and how they were used), the cringe-inducing way that Bob Barker often talked to young female contestants has really soured my opinion of him from my childhood.
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A contrasting view about TTD--the reset of the pot means that the excitement ebbs rather than builds up with each tie, though I think with so many two player categories the fact that I don't recall maybe more than one triple stakes game means you would go from a base pot of $5,000 to the possibility of winning "only" three grand.
Actors are going to act. While I never got the sense that Wink was aiming for gravitas he at least knew how to react to the situation and not go for a big reveal on the first box of the game.
Barker Era is becoming a bit harder of a watch though.
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I've always thought that TTD'90's reputation as one of the worst game shows ever was a bit overblown. The core gameplay was still largely unchanged, the doubling square values in the event of a tie compensated adequately for the pot being reset, and Patrick Wayne honestly wasn't that bad of a host--if he had gotten a bit of coaching to tone it down a notch, he would've been fine.
This was gonna be my answer. I think if there's another decade in-between this and Wink's version, the reviews are a little kinder because the most recent version is a little more distant now. IMO it would help that the 2000 landscape was also kinder to the genre thanks to Reege. Working in television gave me a new perspective to where I wonder how much of Patrick's persona was dictated by producers...he always seemed more lowkey on other shows. In a similar vein, TJW90 would've been better under a different title and maybe without the slot machine. Or maybe they should've gone with the "Classic" format from the beginning.
Shop Til You Drop didn't deserve the contempt some of us - myself included - gave it back in the day either. It never tried to be anything more than what it was: a basic cable game show with two teams doing goofy stunts for prizes. The "Costco" season was pretty dull, tho.
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Rossi Morreale got a bad rap hosting Temptation but after reading this interview he did the best he could with what he had. The interviewer even said: “Not even Bill Cullen would have known what to do with this show.
https://sb2tlopg.wordpress.com/2012/03/02/interview-with-rossi-morreale/
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Greg Palmer spelled commercials wrong on his blog header. That is majestic.
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Regarding Double Talk, many of us have seen the finale, and I thought Henry Polic II was more polished. I'm confused why they changed it to Celebrity Double Talk, because the show didn't really change much and still had contestants. I think the only rule change they made later in the run was that the team only had to get 3 out of 4 to get the bonus points instead of all 4.
Shop Till You Drop was goofy, but honestly towards the end, I couldn't stand Dee Baker... I thought he was a little too over the top... great voice actor, great as Olmec, but overbearing in STYD. Still, I do agree that the Costco format was like when BTB 85 took away the stunts... it was just a dull show. I liked the second announcer/sidekick best, Jason Smith. Mark L Walberg, the show's first announcer/sidekick was okay, but I think Mark was better destined to be a host, but it wasn't until Russian Roulette came along that format and host clicked. I also liked On the Cover. I read that Mark auditioned to be the host of STYD but he was told he was too young. Randy West told me he auditioned to be the show's announcer/sidekick as well.
I'll add that Quicksilver had a good premise, but the presentation was a bit lackluster. It didn't help that the show also had a bad title. I read that the producers couldn't think of a better title for the show. Ron Maestri was... adequate. I think with some tweaks, and more money put into it, it could've had a stronger presence.
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On the flip side of that...while I still enjoy watching the classic TPiR channel (mainly to pay attention to the music cues and how they were used), the cringe-inducing way that Bob Barker often talked to young female contestants has really soured my opinion of him from my childhood.
Ok, I'm glad I'm not the only one. Yes, Bob was a master emcee, etc., etc. Yes, I also noticed took note on how inapporpriate many of his conversations with female contestants were at times. But, I was watching one of the episodes on Buzzr the other day and it was one in which they had time to kill before a commercial break and it was the first taping after they had been on vacation. Bob took the time to ask Dian, Holly, and Janice about their romantic life. Yes, I know this was from 40 years ago and the world was a much different place, but that creeped me out. So, I share in your sentiment.
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On the flip side of that...while I still enjoy watching the classic TPiR channel (mainly to pay attention to the music cues and how they were used), the cringe-inducing way that Bob Barker often talked to young female contestants has really soured my opinion of him from my childhood.
Especially in the early ones, he will sometimes address them as "baby". Different time, I know, but just......ewww.
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Rossi Morreale got a bad rap hosting Temptation but after reading this interview he did the best he could with what he had. The interviewer even said: “Not even Bill Cullen would have known what to do with this show.
Christian C. interviewed Rossi a year or so ago, and he has pretty good knowledge of the genre. Would’ve been nice to see him get another show produced by a more competent crew.
And yeah, early-80s Bob is tough to watch at times. It’s a few 80s hosts that have made me do a double take with the chauvinism.
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I'm not so much bothered by Barker, but am with Gene getting lecherous with the ladies on MG, especially demanding kisses from the first-timers. Didn't really think much of it when I was younger. Guess that could be the seed for an inverse thread of "Didn't bother me then, but does today."
Another "not bad at all" for me was Ruckus. I enjoy it each time I sit through it when digitizing the old tapes
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I watched an episode of Temptation recently for the first time since 2008, and it wasn't as bad as I remember it being. I think since we all had such high hopes for it—especially since we had seen clips/episodes from the Australian series—what we got was more of a let-down back then.
Rossi had a good point in his interview with Christian: if the 80s format was so flawless in comparison, it would have lasted past 1989. According to Mitt Dawson, Grundy tried to drum up support for a syndie version in the early 90s but failed.
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I watched an episode of Temptation recently for the first time since 2008, and it wasn't as bad as I remember it being. I think since we all had such high hopes for it—especially since we had seen clips/episodes from the Australian series—what we got was more of a let-down back then.
Rossi had a good point in his interview with Christian: if the 80s format was so flawless in comparison, it would have lasted past 1989. According to Mitt Dawson, Grundy tried to drum up support for a syndie version in the early 90s but failed.
I was part of a couple of meetings where Reg was attempting a revival. The team that sold the 80s version concurrent with NBC promised the second coming of Wheel--needless to say it fell far short. Too many potential buyers had long enough memories to remember that.
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I watched an episode of Temptation recently for the first time since 2008, and it wasn't as bad as I remember it being. I think since we all had such high hopes for it—especially since we had seen clips/episodes from the Australian series—what we got was more of a let-down back then.
Rossi had a good point in his interview with Christian: if the 80s format was so flawless in comparison, it would have lasted past 1989. According to Mitt Dawson, Grundy tried to drum up support for a syndie version in the early 90s but failed.
I was working at a TV station when Temptation and Merv Griffin's Crosswords premiered. They aired both shows back to back the hour before The Price Is Right.
From what I remember what the GM said was that both shows were "too laid back" as a lead in to Price. IIRC Jerry Springer was airing against Temptation and MGC and was the ratings leader for that hour. Even Matlock reruns on our sister station were doing much better than our 9am game show block.
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Working in television gave me a new perspective to where I wonder how much of Patrick's persona was dictated by producers...he always seemed more lowkey on other shows.
The thing about Patrick is it just seemed so fake and unnatural - like he was trying TOO hard. I'm not sure if it was the direction he received from the producers or him just trying to feign excitement.
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I'm not so much bothered by Barker, but am with Gene getting lecherous with the ladies on MG, especially demanding kisses from the first-timers. Didn't really think much of it when I was younger.
Same here. I love watching Match Game '7x, but Rayburn got a way with a lot on that show that he probably couldn't today...same with Dawson both on Feud and MG.
My wife, who isn't as big a game show fan as I am, even commented on it while watching some of the GSN reruns in recent years.
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Rossi Morreale got a bad rap hosting Temptation but after reading this interview he did the best he could with what he had. The interviewer even said: “Not even Bill Cullen would have known what to do with this show.
https://sb2tlopg.wordpress.com/2012/03/02/interview-with-rossi-morreale/
Rossi wasn't a bad host. the problem was they watered down the format and had the annoying "Temptation Dollars" and the home shopping segments.
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I've always thought that TTD'90's reputation as one of the worst game shows ever was a bit overblown. The core gameplay was still largely unchanged, the doubling square values in the event of a tie compensated adequately for the pot being reset, and Patrick Wayne honestly wasn't that bad of a host--if he had gotten a bit of coaching to tone it down a notch, he would've been fine.
On the flip side of that...while I still enjoy watching the classic TPiR channel (mainly to pay attention to the music cues and how they were used), the cringe-inducing way that Bob Barker often talked to young female contestants has really soured my opinion of him from my childhood.
As someone who watched Price after Square One Television when i was little (this was 1987) the Barker that i remember was a bit more what we knew and loved from his later years. I will say one thing, though Barker was at his lowest point after Rod's death in 2003, but when they got Rich Fields....his mood changed. He seemed to be having more fun than he had ever in his hosting career and it really cemented "The World's Greatest MC" branding. I think he had grey hair when i watched him after Square One Television then (could be wrong).
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I'm not so much bothered by Barker, but am with Gene getting lecherous with the ladies on MG, especially demanding kisses from the first-timers. Didn't really think much of it when I was younger.
Same here. I love watching Match Game '7x, but Rayburn got a way with a lot on that show that he probably couldn't today...same with Dawson both on Feud and MG.
My wife, who isn't as big a game show fan as I am, even commented on it while watching some of the GSN reruns in recent years.
I once watched an MG episode after Ghostwriter when i was a kid (Ghostwriter on PBS, MG on GSN) and i mentioned the same thing to my grandmother, she said that the Gene she watched after Another World in the 60s was not the Gene she watched in the 70s, Rayburn got away with a lot on MG that he probably couldn't today..
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Shop Till You Drop was goofy, but honestly towards the end, I couldn't stand Dee Baker... I thought he was a little too over the top... great voice actor, great as Olmec, but overbearing in STYD.
[snip]
I liked the second announcer/sidekick best, Jason Smith.
I did recall liking Jason when he was around. I'd have to find an ep. on YouTube to see if that opinion holds today.
Agreed re. Dee, especially when he started appearing (in character/costume) in the prize stills during the bonus round.
On that whole note, I could say STYD---and Pat---were not bad.
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Regarding 'The host wasn't actually that bad':
The Caldwell season of Tic Tac Dough, especially the second half of it (thanks GameTV in Canada!). Having seen samples of his work on Top Card, which was generally very good, I'd always had a curiosity as to why folks seemed so particularly contemptuous towards Jim Caldwell's season of TTD and towards him in particular. GSN dropped it right as I got the channel, so I only had a handful of episodes as a sample - and it wasn't a show most folks had taped so there wasn't really a chance to trade for it (or to get a run of several consecutive shows for context).
Thanks to the season's more recent Canadian reruns, got to eventually see basically his entire season. While Jim himself starts off rough and with a definite level of robotic-ness and clearly having been over-coached, by midseason he's clearly gotten the flow of things, has figured out ways to tweak things the show wants him to say to sound slightly less phony (although even end-career Bill Cullen on TJW struggled with this.). Almost all of the B&E shows suffered with issues with the show clearly wanting their emcees to act a certain way, phrase things certain ways, react in a certain manner, don't forget to go for the pun...Jim Peck probably made the "B&E Style" look the most organic (while not having the pacing issues Bill did), but late-stage Caldwell was getting there.
Most of that season of that show's real problems weren't Jim. The re-done set was hideous, even for 1985-86. Yet they kept the distinctly late 70s cheeseball theme (it's not bad, but it's very of-it's-time. And while the red boxes weren't a terrible mechanic, their over-reliance on host spieling meant that a rookie emcee already being coached to overexplain, point out the obvious, and in generally be a cliche* meant that the show itself did Jim no favors.
By year's end, Jim's found his groove and is orders of magnitude better than the initial perception and judgement. It's honestly a shame GSN dropped the show (their last aired was right around 115 or so of 175) RIGHT around the time Jim turned the corner. His last episodes had me genuinely wishing he got a second season.
*In fairness, I also happen to find Wink incredibly overrated (there's a reason his best show, Debt, contains a measure of self-parody). Which makes me more receptive to the "new guy" over "the guy who was here the last seven years". And there's a reason the "Mr. Game Show" toy of the late 80s and many pop culture depictions of game show hosts tend to be most evocative of Wink.
Also, add me to the list who thinks that Pat Finn was generally good and occasionally great - and that he was just done absolutely no favors by Shop Til You Drop [my #1 guilty pleasure] and TJW '90 [which got dramatically better with format #2].
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Watching the Double Talk premiere, I find myself thinking about all my shifts in sentiment towards shows and hosts. Seeing this now, despite the clumsy clue readings, Henry was just fine.
This is why I enjoy the Video & Audio Clips section so much, because it allows everybody a chance to check their memory against actual episodes. I think hosts like Henry, who weren't classically trained broadcasters, are generally treated right by us. It's just that, with enough time and celebrity hosts in the interim, we see they come up in the possibly less-interesting-to-discuss middle ground, rather than a candidate for W0rst Host Evar!!!11
Henry (and those like him) also had the unenviable task of trying the job while guys like Tom Kennedy were still working, coming off as nearly flawless day in, day out.
As for a specific example myself...while I don't blame us/viewers for rejecting Scattergories and its parade of celebrity home video footage, the show itself wasn't a total slog to watch, for me. Dick Clark had a lot to do with that, of course.
-Jason
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As for a specific example myself...while I don't blame us/viewers for rejecting Scattergories and its parade of celebrity home video footage, the show itself wasn't a total slog to watch, for me. Dick Clark had a lot to do with that, of course.
-Jason
It's early 1993. Young me goes through a series of basically endless health issues that winter/spring - which meant a lot of time at home from school with my grandmother (may she rest in peace) who loved game shows even more than I did. She'd watch whatever was available in daytime, and inevitably, flip over to USA.
I absolutely fell in love with this new show called Scattergories. I'd heard it was a board game, but hadn't really seen it played. But I knew the host as Pyramid was in steady reruns on USA. I saw a lot of game shows that spring (and nearly had to repeat a grade due to illnessnes, but that's another story), but Scattergories is the one that always stuck in my head.
Come that summer, I was absolutely crushed when one day suddenly it wasn't on anymore. I knew just enough about TV by then to know what it meant when a show was cancelled, and even in the years where I grew up and moved on from the genre for a while, I always remembered that one.
Cue the era of tape trading, and a couple of episodes later. "Hmm. I completely understand why I liked this when I was young. It doesn't QUITE hit the same sweet spot as an adult, but Dick Clark's still great." I also had the thought that "taping their responses meant the show could draw in celebrities who absolutely, positively, would never commit to sitting in a studio all day for a lengthy taping. There are more than a few celebrities whose only game show credit is this show, precisely because they could tape all their bits wherever they were or wanted to be.
Is the greatest show ever? Nope. Do I still enjoy it a lot more than many other shows? Certainly, in no small part because of the specific nostalgia and memories. Would I be utterly delighted if Buzzr surprises everyone and says it's on the schedule in September? You betcha.
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Piggybacking off Chelsea, in 1993 I don't think 10-year-old me knew what a "bad" game show was. And since network daytime was an endangered species, I was over the moon when I read the TV listings Q&A and found out we were getting a Scrabble reboot along with Scattergories.
Like Chelsea, I now realize they were underwhelming but I was just happy to have daytime game shows and it's still a fun trip down Memory Lane.
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By year's end, Jim's found his groove and is orders of magnitude better than the initial perception and judgement. It's honestly a shame GSN dropped the show (their last aired was right around 115 or so of 175) RIGHT around the time Jim turned the corner. His last episodes had me genuinely wishing he got a second season.
You know, the same goes with NBC dropping daytime Wheel when Rolf was turning a corner.
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Having thought about this, I think John Davidson was a decent host for Time Machine. He stumbled on his words a little, but I thought this was his best effort as a host. I'll cut him some slack since it was his first effort. The show was a nice trip through the years. Several episodes have popped up on YouTube.
Interesting tidbit about John. Sande Stewart stated in his interview for the Strong Museum that John got the Pyramid gig in 1990 because Willard Scott made too many diva demands. First class airfare between NY and L.A., five-star hotels, comped meals, etc. Sande's dad Bob Stewart finally said "Enough" and asked what host was next on the producer's list. That host was John Davidson. So that's how that happened.
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You know, the same goes with NBC dropping daytime Wheel when Rolf was turning a corner.
Yeah, straight into a wall. The last episode (which we only knew because of the extry long credit roll--including camera ops and of course, the flyman Sharkey) Rolf even in casual conversation with Vanna in the parting shot still sounded stiff and uncomfortable. Fitting that Rolf's last "final spin" he hit a Bankrupt (without any of the witticisms that Sajak usually came up with). (OK, technically second-to-last, but work with me here.)
Had NBC hired Goen to begin with, I don't think NBC drops it quite as soon as they did with Rolf. It speaks volumes that CBS wanted no part of retaining Rolf.