The Game Show Forum
The Game Show Forum => The Big Board => Topic started by: Bryce L. on March 13, 2011, 10:18:22 PM
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In the New York era of Pyramid, was there a rule on either CBS or ABC specifically stating, "The champion will be retired after winning match 'x', regardless of if they cleared the Winner's Circle" ? The reason I am asking this is that I recently saw a VERY early episode (aired March 30, 1973), where the champion was on his 7th WC attempt when he finally cleared the board. My thinking is that they would have had to have some kind of rule in place here, or a player could theoretically play ad infinitem, as long as they don't clear the board...
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AFAIK, you could play on until winning in the winner's circle, and while the show was known as "$10,000 Pyramid" a WC win paid $10,000 added on to all money earned previously.
Contestants retired after winning in the WC, or losing to opponent in main game.
When it became "$20,000 Pyramid," your first trip to the winner's circle would earn $10,000 if successful, $15,000 on a second trip if successful, and on all future trips to the winner's circle, they'd be trying to win A TOTAL of $20,000! That was the most they'd take home!
Now, I'm not sure, for example, if a player won $500 with the "Big 7," in their first game, if they would win a total of $10,500 (or just $10k) if they won in the WC on their first attempt, but for sure, they retired immediately and WOULD NOT be able to try for $15k or $20K. (likewise, a $15k winner would retire!)
Maxene Fabe's book, published in 1979, mentioned that the record number of WC attempts, to that date, was seventeen!
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In the $10,000 era, I clearly recall Dick telling a contestant who won on his first try that he'd won $10,500, because he'd also won the Big 7. AFAIK, they didn't change that for $10- and $15,000 wins.
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When it became "$20,000 Pyramid," your first trip to the winner's circle would earn $10,000 if successful, $15,000 on a second trip if successful, and on all future trips to the winner's circle, they'd be trying to win A TOTAL of $20,000! That was the most they'd take home!
At the time, ABC (and CBS) had money limits on how much a contestant could win. ABC's limit was $20,000 at the time; that's why the Pyramid win was a total of $20,000.
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Yes, $20,000 was the total you could win. I remember once instance where a contestant racked up a few thousand in bonuses and previous winner's circle trips, but when she won the $20K, that was what she took home. In other words, it was almost like those previous winnings were forfeited and the $20K is what she got. The rules may have been different for $10K or $15K wins because that was below ABC's limit at the time.
Also, I remember a male contestant somewhere around '76 that made about 12 trips to the winner's circle. I can't remember if he was defeated or won the $20K.
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On Cullen Pyramid, if you won a car, then won $25,000, the value of the car would be subtracted from the cash winnings, leaving the winner with exactly $25,000.
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On Cullen Pyramid, if you won a car, then won $25,000, the value of the car would be subtracted from the cash winnings, leaving the winner with exactly $25,000.
Now that I didn't know. IIRC, the car was the BIG 7 prize during the last season of the show ('78 - '79). I believe there was only one $25K win that season. Tony Randall was the celeb who did it. The car was won by about half the people on the series (15 out of 30). But the only contestant who would've been affected by this is the person who the $25K with Randall.
The '76 - '77 season had the most $25K wins - seven, with Dick Clark involved in two of those wins, once giving and once receing the clues. How versatile.
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I vaguely remember on the CBS version that somebody won on their 12th trip to the WC, and Dick Clark had commented that the contestant had tied the record for most trips. (Then again, keep in mind that "things I vaguely remember" and "things that actually happened" tend to be two different things - "what, they DIDN'T try to give away a boat (after somebody won a car) on the first two weeks of The Joker's Wild?")
(And Cullen Pyramid ran through 78-79? First, I hear about weekly TPIR episodes that never aired in San Francisco, and now this...)
-- Don
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Cullen's Pyramid ran for five seasons starting in '74. So '78 - '79 was the last season. 30 shows each season. Celebs did two shows each, but with a different opponent celeb on each show.
One thing I didn't like about Cullen Pyramid. The contestants were on for both games but partnered with the SAME celeb. God help the contestant who got partnered with Peter Lawford or William Shatner, although Lawford actually won $10K for his partner once. I remember my friend in the audience joking "now she has to play for double or nothing with him."
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Now that I didn't know. IIRC, the car was the BIG 7 prize during the last season of the show ('78 - '79). I believe there was only one $25K win that season. Tony Randall was the celeb who did it. The car was won by about half the people on the series (15 out of 30). But the only contestant who would've been affected by this is the person who the $25K with Randall.
I have a press release for season five which not only serves as an episode guide but, inexplicably, lays out precisely what was won by each player for every show. Talk about your spoilers! Anyway, it confirms that there were fifteen car wins for the season, and that Tony Randall was the only one that season who won $25,000 for his partner. It also helpfully notes 'car absorbed in money', a rather awkwardly worded way of confirming what golden-road is telling us. It also says there were only eleven $10,000 wins, meaning that for the season, players were 13/60 at the Winner's Circle. Also, only five of those eleven players even had a shot at the $25K. The other six lost one of their games.
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I have a press release for season five which not only serves as an episode guide but, inexplicably, lays out precisely what was won by each player for every show. Talk about your spoilers! Anyway, it confirms that there were fifteen car wins for the season, and that Tony Randall was the only one that season who won $25,000 for his partner. It also helpfully notes 'car absorbed in money', a rather awkwardly worded way of confirming what golden-road is telling us. It also says there were only eleven $10,000 wins, meaning that for the season, players were 13/60 at the Winner's Circle. Also, only five of those eleven players even had a shot at the $25K. The other six lost one of their games.
If you're wondering why there was a $25000 upper limit on the syndicated version, it's because for the syndicated version, CBS was the "network of record" for the production and CBS had a $25,000 limit at the time.
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I have a press release for season five which not only serves as an episode guide but, inexplicably, lays out precisely what was won by each player for every show. Talk about your spoilers! Anyway, it confirms that there were fifteen car wins for the season, and that Tony Randall was the only one that season who won $25,000 for his partner. It also helpfully notes 'car absorbed in money', a rather awkwardly worded way of confirming what golden-road is telling us. It also says there were only eleven $10,000 wins, meaning that for the season, players were 13/60 at the Winner's Circle. Also, only five of those eleven players even had a shot at the $25K. The other six lost one of their games.
Interesting item, Matt. Just out of curiosity (since I don't think those other episodes will be surfacing any time soon) which celebs were successful in winning that year? (I know we have $10K wins in four of the six episodes that are out)
13 of 60 is actually a better ratio I think for wins than there was on the daytime version in those days. It looks even better if it means we had at least one win in every two episodes (or close it). In going through the long string of 20K episodes from 1978 that are available, it was generally a "good" week if the big board was hit twice in a week or 2 of 20.
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Interesting item, Matt. Just out of curiosity (since I don't think those other episodes will be surfacing any time soon) which celebs were successful in winning that year? (I know we have $10K wins in four of the six episodes that are out)
It's laid out a little weirdly in that it's not obvious which contestant was paired with which celebrity, and winnings are only associated with the contestant. Going off of the Tony Randall listing, and hoping that the rest of the listings were consistent, then here are the celebrity winners. I put their losing opponent in parenthesis, in case something in the surviving episodes negates my hypothesis, in which case I couldn't tell you which celebrities were the winners.
Soupy Sales (Mackenzie Phillips)
Lois Nettleton (Robert Urich)
Penny Marshall (Robert Klein)
Penny Marshall (Nipsey Russell)
Elaine Joyce (William Shatner)
Robert Klein (Elaine Joyce)
Tony Randall for $25,000 (Lynn Redgrave)
Billy Crystal (Kathy Glass)
Dick Cavett (Kathy Glass)
Adrienne Barbeau (Grant Goodeve)
Grant Goodeve (Della Reese)
Peter Lawford (Debralee Scott)
Also, for the first time I noticed that one of the contestants is named Cindy Pickett. The actress with that name would have been based in New York in her early twenties. Her online biographies say she was on the soap opera Guiding Light from 1976-1980, but sometimes those dates can be a little off. Anyone ever hear her name mentioned as a "before they were stars" possibility? This one played with Soupy Sales (probably her partner) and Joanne Worley.
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Thanks, Matt. Your method jibes with the four circulating episodes from that year where a win happens and doing a quick check of a couple of them, the opening montage also confirms most of the other celeb winners in the manner you list them.
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Thanks, Matt. Your method jibes with the four circulating episodes from that year where a win happens and doing a quick check of a couple of them, the opening montage also confirms most of the other celeb winners in the manner you list them.
The biggest thing on that list that cast doubt in my mind was Penny Marshall winning twice, and beating both Robert Klein and (especially) Nipsey Russell in order to do it!
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LOL. Well, one of her wins made the opening montage so she was certainly capable of catching lightning in a bottle! I can also remember a 1977 $20K win of hers making the montage sequence for the surviving 78 episodes.
If there was one Cullen Pyramid episode that I wish had been among the stash that made it out it would have been the episode from 77-78 where Garry Moore played and won (since he is seen winning in the opening on a couple other episodes for that year). This would have been taped at the same time he stepped down as TTTT host and it would have been nice to see him on the other side doing some game playing for a change and coming up a winner. Aside from that, the 26 that got out do give more than a reasonable flavor of the show from beginning to end of run.
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I remember the "List." it was given out as part of the press kit provided by Viacom. Somewhere, I have a copy of the list for the second season, 1975-76. I was taking a media course in High School. Pyramid was the topic of my term paper; made all the better by my having the opportunity to interview several contestants from that season. The list included their contact information. Dick Clark's back-to-back wins (in taping order) were second season episodes. I was in the studio on tape day and eventually interviewed both his contestant partners for my paper.
Recollections of life in Stewartville are pretty much on the mark. A contestant would play until losing to an opponent in the front game or clearing the Big Board. From 1973 until 1976, a jackpot win would add $10,000 to any previous winnings. Similarly, all winnings on the Cullen show were kept unless you cleared the second Big Board. At that point, your total would top off at $25,000.
From 1976 until 1980, clearing the Big Board augmented your winnings to the Jackpot total only.
Peter Lawford used to agonize over his inability to clear the Big Board. He finally achieved a win on the daytime show in 1974 or 1975. An audience member rushed on stage to present him with a novelty newspaper. The headline read, "Pyramid Staff Rejoices! Lawford Finally Wins!"
Last and certainly not least, the contestant who won seventeen consecutive main games in 1978 was Ruth Hlavacek. I may be wrong about the spelling although I remember her very well. Lois Nettelton, Dick Cavett, Ruth and Me. "Pyramid, July 20, 1978, Part 3." It's on YouTube and my blog. (http://"http://singingexterminator.blogspot.com") My "fee spot" was edited out, I am sad to say. Air transportation for the entire week of shows was provided by my shirt collar.
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We're fortunate that Dick's two wins are among those episodes that are in the hobby thanks to those 1985 repeats on Channel 55!
Ruth actually is not the contestant who was on for 17 games if that was the record. Her entire run on the show was aired by GSN and she actually made it through 13 games (including a tie on the final Friday show of the Nettleton-Cavett week) and then got beaten on the Wednesday show of the following week with Debralee Scott-Sal Viscuso. Her accumulated winnings of a little over $7000 were a record for someone who never hit the big board.
And then the irony. The contestant who beat her, an out of work attorney named Roger Zeigman, then proceeded to hit the $10,000 on his first try!
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Has anyone posted Dick Clark's other episode with the (at the time) law student. Leslie? I'd love to see it.
Didn't Ruth's run start with the Monday episode of the Nettleton/Cavett week? I do remember she won the most money without hitting the jackpot.
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Yes, her run began on Monday in the second game when she played the champ, Frank, to a tie game that had reached the high 30s when time ran out and they decided on Tuesday to start over from scratch. So she was on eight shows altogether.
A couple of weeks after Ruth's run, there was another long-term futile champ, Jim Hickey who failed in at least 11 attempts (GSN skipped his first appearances so he may have had as many as 12-13) and came away with $5900.
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I wish I knew how to upload or I'd gladly do the honors re: the second Clark episode. On that one, he received the clues both times in the Winner's Circle instead of giving.
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I wish I knew how to upload or I'd gladly do the honors re: the second Clark episode. On that one, he received the clues both times in the Winner's Circle instead of giving.
Send it to me, Eric. I'll gladly upload it.
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E-mail me, epaddon AOL.com and I'll be glad to work it out.