The Game Show Forum
The Game Show Forum => The Big Board => Topic started by: MikeK on September 01, 2003, 10:07:58 PM
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http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detai...&s=dvd&n=507846 (http://\"http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B0000ALFZ0/qid=1062468276/sr=8-3/ref=sr_8_3/002-5485437-6650453?v=glance&s=dvd&n=507846\")
From what I read elsewhere, this set will have episodes from the first 3 seasons, shows that weren't part of the syndication package.
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From what I read elsewhere, this set will have episodes from the first 3 seasons, shows that weren't part of the syndication package.
Wonder if it'll include the Story family's appearance so we can finally get the true status of Groucho's \"cigar\" remark...
Chuck Donegan (The Illusrious \"Chuckie Baby\")
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[quote name=\'hmtriplecrown\' date=\'Sep 1 2003, 09:07 PM\']http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detai...&s=dvd&n=507846 (http://\"http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B0000ALFZ0/qid=1062468276/sr=8-3/ref=sr_8_3/002-5485437-6650453?v=glance&s=dvd&n=507846\")
From what I read elsewhere, this set will have episodes from the first 3 seasons, shows that weren't part of the syndication package.[/quote]
Hence \"The Lost Episodes\" title.
Paul Brownstein, who handles the program sales now for the Marx and Guedel estates for \"YBYL\" (the original \"Best of Groucho\" package, the \"lost episodes\" package represented here and the sort-of spinoff \"Tell It to Groucho\"), had tried to pitch the \"lost episodes\" package to some cable networks, but seemingly got no interest. But since vintage TV is doing very well on DVD, we're getting this set. If this does well, perhaps Sony Music might want to do a \"Best of 'The Best of Groucho'\" package.
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Interesting that Sony Music is handling the distribution of YBYL DVDs. Somebody at Sony Music should talk to somebody at Sony Television to see if there might be any other game shows in the TV div. vaults that might warrant DVD release.
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[quote name=\'Jimmy Owen\' date=\'Sep 2 2003, 05:46 PM\'] Interesting that Sony Music is handling the distribution of YBYL DVDs. Somebody at Sony Music should talk to somebody at Sony Television to see if there might be any other game shows in the TV div. vaults that might warrant DVD release. [/quote]
The Newlywed Game would probably the most popular of the SOny owned shows to put on DVD, and maybe the Gong Show(would have been an idea to tie in with the release of the COnfessions film earlier this year)
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Any indication anywhere as to exactly how many episodes will be included in the package? Part of the problem I've had with YBYL sets in the past is the limited number of episodes they contain. The largest to this point has been a seven-VHS set (a gift to me from another member of this board, actually) but which only contained two episodes per tape.
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Hey, how about TPIR on DVD coming soon! It would get to be costly for the tape/dvd collectors, but well worth the $$$$
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I wouldn't mind a potpourri of Sony games on a disc, sorta like what they did with some of the 70's crime dramas. In addition to releasing DVD box sets of the original \"Charlie's Angels\" and \"SWAT,\" they put out a disc with eps of those two plus \"Starsky and Hutch,\" \"The Rookies\" and \"Police Woman.\" Maybe put out a disc of Barris shows NG, DG, Gong Show 3AC, TH, etc. and if that performs well, a B-E set, Bob Stewart set and a Merv Griffin set. These would be for nostalgia kitsch value mostly, and a way to generate income from the library, as the shows are too old to be shown on cable anymore.
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These would be for nostalgia kitsch value mostly, and a way to generate income from the library, as the shows are too old to be shown on cable anymore.
Hmmm....TVLand just started airing \"Mr Ed\" this week.
I think that's what has a lot of us confused - that a channel like TVLand can air a lot of old shows all the time, but a channel like GSN has to rely on the more recent stuff.
It's been mentioned that GSN averages around a 0.6 or 0.7 for many of its shows. Does anyone know what TVLand averages?
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[quote name=\'Ian Wallis\' date=\'Sep 3 2003, 11:26 AM\']Hmmm....TVLand just started airing \"Mr Ed\" this week.
I think that's what has a lot of us confused - that a channel like TVLand can air a lot of old shows all the time, but a channel like GSN has to rely on the more recent stuff.
It's been mentioned that GSN averages around a 0.6 or 0.7 for many of its shows. Does anyone know what TVLand averages?[/quote]
This is a list of the 25 top-rated ad-supported basic cable channels as of last March. (http://\"http://www.allyourtv.com/ratings/ratingscablenetworks.html\") TV Land is in the top 25 in prime time with over 600,000 viewers, but doesn't place in the top 25 on a day-long average. GSN isn't in either list.
The perceived difference between TV Land and GSN is that TV Land is branded as a vintage TV channel and nothing else. The audience tunes to TV Land expecting to see vintage TV and (more or less) gets it. (The arguments can reign over what is \"vintage\" or \"classic,\" especially as the initial audience gets older and out of the desirable demos, but if \"classic TV\" can be considered not what's rerun at the dinner hour and late at night on broadcast stations and the big cable channels, TV Land fits the bill.)
On the other hand, GSN has never been branded as a \"classic\" game show channel--simply as a game show channel (or a channel about gaming and games featuring game shows). People tune into GSN (or are expected to tune into GSN) expecting game shows in general, not necessarily vintage game shows. Due to financial constraints, of course, the early years were almost entirely vintage programming, but simply by the presence of the \"Prime Games\" interstitials, there was already evidence that the channel was not to be just old shows--and when the household levels were considered high enough to make original programming feasible (which personally I still believe that 1998 was way too soon to jump in, since GSN had barely cracked the 15 million home mark), they started commissioning said original programming.
The difference is that TV Land (launched by Rich Cronin) has always known exactly what it wants to be and has been able to stick to it with minimal interference from Viacom suits (even after Mel \"Higher Profit Margins Now!\" Karmazin was put in charge). GSN seems to have never really had a clear vision of what it wants to be, mostly because Sony suits have seemed to think totally in the short-term how-can-we-get-young-demos instead of the long-term. I think Rich Cronin and Bob Boden do have a certain vision of what GSN is and were able to begin to execute it with minimal meddling from Sony and Liberty--and then we come upon the decision for the video game block, which still smacks to me as nothing more but clueless execs from either Sony or Liberty whining about not getting young demos and not holding on to that 1.5 million viewers who watched the Michael Larsen doc--and Rich and Bob doing this simply to shut them up, knowing damn well that it doesn't fit GSN's profile and it's not going to work. But that's business.
If it's any comfort, it does seem that the diehards of other niche entertainment channels have the same complaint--and unless the whole business model of television changes, the complaints will be around for years to come.
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[quote name=\'HSquares2003\' date=\'Sep 2 2003, 05:17 PM\'] Hey, how about TPIR on DVD coming soon! It would get to be costly for the tape/dvd collectors, but well worth the $$$$ [/quote]
Hey, how about telling us, after the 300 of us who would actually be interested in such a beast have snapped up our copies, what landfill they're gonna dump the rest of the print run in?
Really, just once I wish people would think about these things....
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What are the economics of producing a DVD? I just bought a 8 episode DVD of \"Stories of the Century,\" the 1954 series with Jim \"Jock Ewing\" Davis and Mary Castle for less than $3.00. Not every DVD has to be a million seller. In the case of TPIR, I can see a few possible buyers besides us. General TV fans and people who were on the show. Not a 500 disc box set perhaps, but maybe they could offer date specific DVDs for the folks who were in the audience that day, the people who got to contestant's row and on stage and their relatives.
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[quote name=\'clemon79\' date=\'Sep 3 2003, 03:23 PM\'] Hey, how about telling us, after the 300 of us who would actually be interested in such a beast have snapped up our copies, what landfill they're gonna dump the rest of the print run in? [/quote]
I guess we'll know soon, about a week or two after Gigli comes out on DVD.
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[quote name=\'Jimmy Owen\' date=\'Sep 3 2003, 03:58 PM\'] What are the economics of producing a DVD? I just bought a 8 episode DVD of "Stories of the Century," the 1954 series with Jim "Jock Ewing" Davis and Mary Castle for less than $3.00.
[/quote]
Do the words \"public domain\" strike a familiar note? That's why you couldn't swing a dead cat a few years ago without hitting a copy of \"It's a Wonderful Life.\" Then, somehow, NBC got the copyright and managed to put the others away.
So this DVD is probably of a movie whose copyright expired or is lost in legal limbo. The only cost then is the raw materials for the DVD (10 cents plastic) and the time and man-hours to transfer the original film to a master DVD, which can be copied ad infinitum. You don't have to sell many to make money.
That wouldn't be the case with TPIR.
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Yes, Dr.B, my purchase was a public domain title complete with splices and cue marks, but it was a good show! Have you noticed that a PD release can prove there is value in those libraries. This is off topic, but since Michael Landon once appeared on Match Game, I'll mention it. \"Bonanza\" episodes were on first on DVD from these Public Domain outfits (how \"Bonanza\" got into the public domain I don't know). You can get 20 episode sets for less than 10 bucks. The copyright owner, Republic (Viacom/Paramount subsidiary) has just released (through Artisan) a \"Bonanza\" disc of their own with eps that have not fallen into the public domain. It's $22.50 but it's out there. Re: \"Wonderful Life,\" that is also a Republic title that is leased to NBC for broadcast. The DVD is from Republic/Artisan.
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[quote name=\'clemon79\' date=\'Sep 3 2003, 03:23 PM\'] [quote name=\'HSquares2003\' date=\'Sep 2 2003, 05:17 PM\'] Hey, how about TPIR on DVD coming soon! It would get to be costly for the tape/dvd collectors, but well worth the $$$$ [/quote]
Hey, how about telling us, after the 300 of us who would actually be interested in such a beast have snapped up our copies, what landfill they're gonna dump the rest of the print run in?
Really, just once I wish people would think about these things.... [/quote]
I'd say right next door to that one landfill in Arizona where they dumped all those unsold ET Atari cartridges...
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It's simple, really.
If there were even a marginal market for the stuff (and, with the way the DVD mania's growing, there theoretically could be), Sony/GSN/Fremantle/whomever could release a four-hour \"best of\" DVD of each of the \"classic\" games in their respective libraries. The discs could contain a mix of complete episodes and highlight clips; with trivia, show histories, clear theme song tracks, and other extras depending on space availability.
Yrs.,
Clark H.
http://www.miscmedia.com (http://\"http://www.miscmedia.com\")
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There could be market value on those OGSMs... Show the clips unedited or uncensored... or something.
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[quote name=\'clarkh\' date=\'Sep 4 2003, 04:07 AM\'] It's simple, really.
If there were even a marginal market for the stuff (and, with the way the DVD mania's growing, there theoretically could be), Sony/GSN/Fremantle/whomever could release a four-hour \"best of\" DVD of each of the \"classic\" games in their respective libraries. The discs could contain a mix of complete episodes and highlight clips; with trivia, show histories, clear theme song tracks, and other extras depending on space availability.
[/quote]
I'd be first in line for \"The Best of Hollywood Connection.\"
Curious question---I know Chuck Henry forbid NYSI89 from airing [and rumors persist that Rayburn banned MG/HS] but would these DVDs fall under the ban? If you want to nitpick, techically, putting the stuff on DVD isn't really the same as actually airing it. Only those who want to buy the DVD ever see it.
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[quote name=\'PeterMarshallFan\' date=\'Sep 4 2003, 02:57 PM\'] I'd be first in line for "The Best of Hollywood Connection."
[/quote]
Comeback A) Would you really need a DVD to store that? Wouldn't, say, a photograph suffice? ;)
Comeback B) You'd be the _last_ in line too. :)
Curious question---I know Chuck Henry forbid NYSI89 from airing [and rumors persist that Rayburn banned MG/HS] but would these DVDs fall under the ban? If you want to nitpick, techically, putting the stuff on DVD isn't really the same as actually airing it. Only those who want to buy the DVD ever see it.
Yes. As a general rule, trying to nitpick with copyright lawyers is a bad idea.
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[quote name=\'PeterMarshallFan\' date=\'Sep 4 2003, 04:57 PM\'] I'd be first in line for "The Best of Hollywood Connection."
Curious question---I know Chuck Henry forbid NYSI89 from airing [and rumors persist that Rayburn banned MG/HS] but would these DVDs fall under the ban? If you want to nitpick, techically, putting the stuff on DVD isn't really the same as actually airing it. Only those who want to buy the DVD ever see it. [/quote]
I'd be first in line for \"Best of Monopoly\" !
On the subject. Isn't it true that Rolf Benirschke has also forbid his \"Wheel\" shows from airing again ?
-Joe R.
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I seriously doubt Chuck or Rolf would have the ability to block the airings. Besides, they won't even show the Narz NYSI or Bob Goen's WOF so why the guessing? Don't worry though, I have tapes with 10 or so eps of Chuck's NYSI, which he has not tried to stop me from watching. I also have a couple of Rolf's shows. This is one the many speculations over the years that has no basis in fact. Previous speculations proven wrong include the following: The entire run of Peter Marshall's Hollywood Squares was destroyed. The Larson episodes of PYL will never be shown again. CBS destroyed the run of \"TJW\" Where is the proof on these speculations?
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[quote name=\'Jimmy Owen\' date=\'Sep 4 2003, 11:15 PM\'] Besides, they won't even show the Narz NYSI or Bob Goen's WOF so why the guessing? [/quote]
Difference is, they HAVE shown the Narz NYSI...I think it was a staple of the original schedule, and then it came back on weekends (which I never remembered to set my VCR for, grr, why can't they run it now that I have Tivo?) right after the Dark Period.
And it's wekk-known that Henry was not happy with NTSI '89, and as host, I'm quite sure he CAN block them from airing.
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Chuck should not be ashamed of NYSI. \"Eye on Hollywood\" and \"The Love Report,\" yes.
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[quote name=\'JRaygor\' date=\'Sep 4 2003, 11:38 PM\'] I'd be first in line for \"Best of Monopoly\" ! [/quote]
And I'd be in the back of the line--right behind you!
Seriously (and off-topic), the game show helped me develop a couple of Monopoly house rules, such as:
- Rent: On the show, the rent on an unimproved property was half its value. Could you imagine landing on Mediterranean Avenue with no houses
(which actually happened) and answering a question for two dollars? Thirty is a little more sensible, but for the board game, I'd meet in the middle, like 20% of face value ($12-$80). Like on the show, each house counts 20% of the hotel rent (i.e. Illinois Avenue with 3 houses = 60% x $1100 = $660).
- Income Tax: Instead of choosing between $200 and 10% of your total worth, just pay 10% of your cash in hand (rounded down).
- Railroads: If you land on a railroad you own, you can travel to any unowned property and buy it for 150% of the face value. It's more costly, but assembling monopolies quicker can speed up the game.
- Go to Jail: Instead of spending three turns in jail, pay the fine right away.
ObGameShow: Free Parking was in play on the game show. Makes me wonder who the first person to do that was, since now it's a universal house rule, but the official board game rules don't allow it.
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Chuck should not be ashamed of NYSI. \"Eye on Hollywood\" and \"The Love Report,\" yes.
The only reason TLR made it to air was because on the aired pilot, they revealed that John Davidson had an affair during his 1st marriage, and they were hoping the show could come up w/more attention-grabbers like that once they went to series. It didn't, hence its short run.
Chuck Donegan (The Illustrious \"Chuckie Baby\")
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Remember that house rules virtually always are designed to make the game faster, simpler and/or more fun.
Rent: On the show, the rent on an unimproved property was half its value. Could you imagine landing on Mediterranean Avenue with no houses (which actually happened) and answering a question for two dollars? Thirty is a little more sensible, but for the board game, I'd meet in the middle, like 20% of face value ($12-$80).
This doesn't make the game faster, simpler OR more fun. Some properties have cheap rent. Pay it, move on.
- Income Tax: Instead of choosing between $200 and 10% of your total worth, just pay 10% of your cash in hand (rounded down).
Ten percent of your cash is certainly simpler than tediously figuring out your entire worth. Most house rules, though, simply say forget the 10%, just pay the $200.
- Railroads: If you land on a railroad you own, you can travel to any unowned property and buy it for 150% of the face value. It's more costly, but assembling monopolies quicker can speed up the game.
I like this (and it makes the whole \"railroad\" concept make more sense, like the TV show) but I wouldn't bother with the 150% business. Another way: Rather than ANY unowned property, landing on your own railroad allows you to advance to the NEAREST unowned property.
- Go to Jail: Instead of spending three turns in jail, pay the fine right away.
You can already do that in the official rules, and you absolutely should in the early going when there are properties to buy. Later, when there's less of a reason to travel, staying in jail as long as you can is better.
ObGameShow: Free Parking was in play on the game show. Makes me wonder who the first person to do that was, since now it's a universal house rule, but the official board game rules don't allow it.
It's certainly the most common house rule (and predates the game show by decades) but I have no idea what the history of it is. I was disappointed to see them use it on the TV show, since it made the rule look \"official\" when it's not. I was impressed, however, to see Reilly correctly pronounce the \"Redding\" Railroad.
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[quote name=\'clemon79\' date=\'Sep 5 2003, 10:24 AM\']And it's wekk-known that Henry was not happy with NTSI '89, and as host, I'm quite sure he CAN block them from airing.[/quote]
The one nagging about this always has been that one would assume that a standard talent contract in 1989 would cover the rights to a performance in any means of television distribution, past, present or future. The reason MGP had to go back and clear the pre-1980 shows for GSN is because the original contracts only covered standard broadcast television and didn't account for cable or satellite television. It seems to me that if Henry's 1989 contract mentioned that he was giving permission for retransmission on any means of television, he had signed out and could no nothing about it.
However, it looks like MGP as a professional courtesy did contact Henry along with everyone else they had to contact to reclear the shows--and he didn't give his permission. I also have the feeling that it would reflect MGP's own corporate culture, as well. If Fremantle was reclearing the old shows and they felt that Henry's contract didn't requiring reclearing \"NYSI '89,\" they would've greenlit the show for GSN play pronto, because they contractually could, whether Henry liked it or not.
Of course, if the legal language wasn't there and Henry did have a leg to stand on (or if Chris C. tells me that G-T/MGP's corporate culture wasn't that courteous), then I'm full of hooey.
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If I can just bring this thread on-topic for a minute...
There's a DVD review at DVD Talk (http://\"http://www.dvdtalk.com/reviews/read.php?ID=7496\"). I miss the show since watching it late nights in the cable days, and my PBS station doesn't air any episodes. Hopefully, this DVD doesn't reek of compression issues.
Clarence
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The reason MGP had to go back and clear the pre-1980 shows for GSN is because the original contracts only covered standard broadcast television and didn't account for cable or satellite television.
From what I understand, that would only cover shows from 1973 onwards. A letter I got from GSN in 1996 (back when they actually answered letters from viewers) stated that any show after 1973 they have to get the celebrity to clear it before they can air it. Presumably, any show before 1973 they can do anything they want to it.
I guess they're also getting more clearances as time goes on - case in point: the premiere week of 1980s \"Tattletales\"which aired recently, but had never been aired on GSN before.