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This probably focuses more on '70s and '80s daytime schedules than it does today, but I've been wondering about exactly when stations make the decisions to pre-empt network shows.
Let's say you have a marginable game show that is just about to be cancelled and replaced by another game show. At some point local affiliates must have access to the pilot of the new show to decide whether or not to carry it. Does/did the network screen it to all stations via closed-curcuit, or did each station get sent a tape of the pilot? Are the stations that decide not to carry the new show required to let the network know of their intentions?
It's interesting to watch what happens when shows become hits. The stations that pre-empt probably figure they could do better with a syndicated show they already have rights to, but sometimes stations that originally pre-empted a show will place it on the lineup - frequently in tape delay. Other times an independent station in the city might pick up the show. Still, on some other occasions this hit show may never be seen in that area at all, despite the fact the previous (and less successful) show was.
It would be neat to hear some "behind-the-scenes" stories about this. Anyone have any thoughts on this topic?
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[quote name=\'Ian Wallis\' date=\'Sep 11 2005, 06:47 PM\']It would be neat to hear some "behind-the-scenes" stories about this. Anyone have any thoughts on this topic?
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Is it possible that the person in charge of programming just might not like game shows? I know in the mid-80s, the only daytime show WTKR (our CBS affiliate) had was TPiR, and eventually Card Sharks. Maybe they were aware TPiR was a ratings winner, but they could pull better numbers with other programming (they put Hour Magazine in place of $25K Pyramid and PYL).
Of course, with noon shows, a lot of affiliates feel news is more important, which I could understand.
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I can recall a time when WUSA-9 (or was it WTOP-9? or WDVM-9?) didn't show the full CBS game lineup. We never got Eubanks Card Sharks or Combs Feud. PYL wasn't on for the entire run, either. The only things that were locked in were the TPIR/Pyramid hour and the MG/TattleTales hour.
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There was a time when the CBS affil in Saginaw (WEYI-TV) did not clear TPIR, opting for "The 700 Club." They used to have an "Ask the Manager" segment on the midday show where the GM would field programming questions and the GM said he personally did not like TPIR and did not want the station to air it. Knowing what I know now, I'm sure CBN paid better compensation than CBS, though that was never mentioned by the GM. Our cable company was kind enough to bring in TPIR from an out-of-market station and put it on one of the local origination channels.
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Being originally from Bay City, I remember that. The only Price I remembered from the 1970s was the half-hour network and syndicated version -- not having cable (or an outdoor antenna pointed towards Cadillac, Lansing or Detroit), as well as going to school during the day, I didn't see the hour version for the first time until 1979, when our family moved to Florida.
Around 1977, though, I think WEYI showed sitcoms (including "That Girl") during Price's hour.
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Brandon's unfinished thoughts on daytime pre-emptions!
I'm finally understanding why daytime programming, esp. games, are a thing of the past...my station has Regis and Kelly, Dr. Phil, and The View from 9-12 am, and the station is #1 all three hours, as well as during the noon news. I have a feeling if ABC were to propose a new game during that block, my station would decline, just for the reason that they know that they have guaranteed numbers with their block.
Then again, we could always sacrifice the 12:30 newscast. The 12:30 half-hour gets beat by Y&R anyways. ;-)
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For rugrats: WEYI used to cover TPIR and Gambit/Double Dare/Here's Lucy with a combination of Mike Douglas and 700 Club from early 76 to late 77. That Girl was generally seen at 1pm. When Tattletales moved to 10am, WEYI cleared that by moving 700 Club to 9am and covering TPIR with Merv Griffin. In early 79 Merv was replaced by a combo of Ed Allen and Beverly Hillbillies. TPIR finally got cleared again in the late fall of 79.
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I think it's a case of both affiliate preference and money. Here in Louisville, our NBC affiliate carried virtually every NBC game in the 80's, even pre-empting whatever 10 am sitcom the network aired for the noon show (Just Men, Hot Potato, Super Password, etc.). They also had most of the syndicated game offerings as well (Kennedy TPIR, $1M COAL).
OTOH, our CBS affil. (now ABC) never picked up any games from syndication, and never aired Beat The Clock, Whew!, Child's Play, Tattletales, Body Language, Press Your Luck (save for the last couple of weeks in '85), and cleared Pyramid starting in fall '84, but they did air TPIR, however. They usually aired B/W sitcom reruns in the 10:30 slot, more than likely for monetary reasons, but finally cleared the slot when Card Sharks premiered.
Tyshaun
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While prejudices play some part, let's be honest - a station would put a video camera on a tar pit and show it 24/7 if it could make more money than it does now.
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[quote name=\'Jimmy Owen\' date=\'Sep 11 2005, 09:39 PM\']There was a time when the CBS affil in Saginaw (WEYI-TV) did not clear TPIR, opting for "The 700 Club." They used to have an "Ask the Manager" segment on the midday show where the GM would field programming questions and the GM said he personally did not like TPIR and did not want the station to air it. Knowing what I know now, I'm sure CBN paid better compensation than CBS, though that was never mentioned by the GM. Our cable company was kind enough to bring in TPIR from an out-of-market station and put it on one of the local origination channels.
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Station managers are so F*cking Selfish!
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[quote name=\'Jamey Greek\' date=\'Sep 12 2005, 05:06 PM\']Station managers are so F*cking Selfish!
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If it makes you feel better, station managers who put personal biases ahead of programming decisions that attract the largest number of viewers usually aren't station managers for very long.
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That is correct, that guy left in 79. However, just today, I sat down to watch that very same station for the season preem of FF that everybody's been talking about. Some last-minute infomercials filled the slot instead.
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In Pittsburgh, KDKA-TV [CBS] 2 pre-empted Ludden Password [Daytime] from 1961-64 to show movies and later, "The Mike Douglas Show", though the station later showed PW on delay in a morning slot. And from 1966 to 1973, what was then WIIC, now WPXI, [NBC] 11 pre-empted Fleming Jeopardy to show news at Noon.
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Back in the day, the stations' rationale for pre-empting the network could be summarized: If we can get better ratings and make more money off of a local show or a syndicated show than we can collecting the network compensation fee, we'll run the local or syndicated show.
And don't forget that in the 60s and 70s, there was no such thing as "cash plus"--on cash syndicated shows the stations got all of the commercial time. Even on barter shows--which weren't that common since barter syndication was considered low-class back then--the barter advertiser only took a minute of inventory, not one-half to 60 percent like they do today. If they could make more money and pull better numbers from that than the network compensation fee and maybe a minute of ad time within the show, there was no choice.
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In the Cleveland area, we never got to see "Body Language" in its original run because the CBS affiliate at the time put something else on at 4 P.M., Eastern time. (I saw it on family trips out of town, and much later on GSN.) "Press Your Luck" suffered the same fate here when it moved to the same time slot in 1986.
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One of the weirder decisions came out of Chicago (at the time one of only three markets where all three major networks owned and operated the local affiliates--NYC and L.A. being the other two). And yes, I've told this story before (so feel free to leave the room ;-) ).
In 1982, upon wresting Phil Donahue's syndie gabfest away from its longtime home at WGN, CBS O&O WBBM slotted the show to run at 9AM CT. The fall out of this was that whatever network programming WBBM was running got displaced. So what WBBM did was move the sitcom reruns (soon to be displaced by PYRAMID and CHILD'S PLAY) back an hour, thus moving TPiR to 3PM CT (after the sudsers), thus moving UP TO THE MINUTE/TT to 11AM CT and moving Y&R to 11:30.
The kicker--the shows that were displaced (save for Y&R) all ran on a one-day delay once moved (even TPiR, which was on much later than its network starting time). Once Donahue moved to NBC's WMAQ in 1986, WBBM brought PYRAMID, CS86 and TPiR back to their network slots (and moved back to same-day airing)--PYL stayed at 11AM on a one-day delay.
Mark J. *might* remember this--WMAQ ran a show for a time in 1987 that caused them to schedule WoF at 3PM (unfortunately, I don't recall what that show was).
Doug
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The kicker--the shows that were displaced (save for Y&R) all ran on a one-day delay once moved (even TPiR, which was on much later than its network starting time). Once Donahue moved to NBC's WMAQ in 1986, WBBM brought PYRAMID, CS86 and TPiR back to their network slots (and moved back to same-day airing)--PYL stayed at 11AM on a one-day delay.
What episodes of those displaced shows did WBBM run on the day the schedule changed? Did they repeat the Friday shows? I guess when they moved back in 1986, that must have meant that one episode of each was never broadcast in Chicago(?)
Along the same lines, it still puzzles me why NBC would allow their affiliates in the early '90s to run the network shows in whatever order they wanted. Reading old TVGuides from that time frame, some shows you could see in three consecutive half hours on different stations. It also led to some weird scheduling - such as LA O&O KNBC running "Scrabble" in the wee hours of the night.
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[quote name=\'Ian Wallis\' date=\'Sep 14 2005, 04:40 PM\']What episodes of those displaced shows did WBBM run on the day the schedule changed? Did they repeat the Friday shows? I guess when they moved back in 1986, that must have meant that one episode of each was never broadcast in Chicago(?)
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To be honest, I'm not totally sure. I'm pretty sure but not completely sure that the moves took effect 1/4/82 (there was no Friday TPiR because of New Year's), with the 12/31/81 TPiR airing on that day at 3PM (one of the showcases being a salute to the anniversary of Barker's first ToC; I usually got home from high school before 3PM so I was able to watch--and don't ask me why I remember that ;-) ). Whether the 12/31/81 TPiR also aired on WBBM the previous Thursday with the rest of the network I don't remember. I also don't recall whether the Friday eps of PYRAMID, CS86 and TPiR were ever shown when WBBM went back to running same-day (I was at my summer internship by then, but more than likely I would've been watching whatever NBC had on at the time [$otC, WoF and SCRABBLE, ask no questions about FAMILY TIES reruns :) ]).
[quote name=\'Ian Wallis\' date=\'Sep 14 2005, 04:40 PM\']Along the same lines, it still puzzles me why NBC would allow their affiliates in the early '90s to run the network shows in whatever order they wanted. Reading old TVGuides from that time frame, some shows you could see in three consecutive half hours on different stations. It also led to some weird scheduling - such as LA O&O KNBC running "Scrabble" in the wee hours of the night.
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And if memory serves, KNBC and WRC (the O&O in Washington) ran CLASSIC CONCENTRATION in the wee hours as well in 1992. WMAQ also played with its schedule but at least kept ClCn on at 9:30.
Doug
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Growing up in Lancaster, PA, though the '80s, I remember some of what went on with pre-emptions and whatnot. I'm sure Aaron Sica can fill in some of my gaps.
Our TV Guide listed *four* CBS stations, even though only three markets were covered. Our Harrisburg/Lancater/Lebanon/York market had two CBS affils, and my local cable system carried both plus WCAU from Philly. So I always saw all the CBS shows in one way or another.
NBC was a different story...my very own WGAL (NBC Lancaster) must have pre-empted a good number of shows in the late '80s because I don't remember seeing them carrying $ale or Super Password. If they did, it was late night. KYW, then an NBC affiliate owned by Group W, would air games all over the place. I have vague memories of seeing SP airing at 3pm, and I don't think KYW had noon news, so they would air games in that slot as well.
My game show memory starts right about 1986 or 1987, so I don't remember what our ABC affils from Harrisburg (WHTM) and Philly (WPVI) carried in daytime games. I do remember watching Match Game for parts of its run on WHTM, though. I don't remember seeing Brucie or Double Talk though.
To go back to the topic posed here...I know from talking to Carol, the lady at WGAL who has made programming decisions there for the past 25+ years, that it's basically about ratings (money) and keeping us Lancastrians-who-hate-change satisfied, watching intently, and of course, buying whatever it is in they're trying to sell. They have rarely moved shows in mid-season in the past 20 years unless the show was cancelled.
WGAL did carry Caesar, Scattergories, and both versions of Scrabble through their entire run. I do not remember if they carried Wheel or not, but Goen Wheel did air here, and I have vivid memories of wondering "WTF!" about the $50 space. (Well, I was 8 or so, so the "F" probably meant "Fudge.") From growing up here, I always got the vibe that WGAL never really liked carrying games in daytime. I would occasionally see listings for WRC and be jealous. "Look what they've got!"
I remember going to my grandparents' house in northern PA over Christmas breaks. They live in McKean County, which is interestingly enough in the Buffalo, NY DMA. So WGRZ there aired a lot of shows I never saw anywhere else, including Classic Concentration and $ale. WGAL picked up CC right around the time they started rerunning the whole series, and kept it in daytime for what seemed like an awfully long time after.
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When the networks allowed the O&O's to tinker with the schedule, that opened the Pandora's Box which eventually led to the death of daytime game shows. I have a front-page article from Variety from 89 that outlined the changes. The O&O's were high on an hour-long revival of "House Party" and wanted to put it in a good daytime slot. In LA, this meant dumping "Scrabble" to overnight. To be fair, the article mentions "Scrabble" was tied for last place in net daytme with ABC's "Perfect Strangers" repeats.
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I remember WTKR aired the CBS Wheel on a one day delay, becuase they aired it earlier. They also never aired the Family Feud Challenge, although they did air the syndicated version.
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Attempting to fill in some of Mitch's gaps...
The last noon game show that WGAL aired was "Card Sharks" on August 1, 1980. Coincident with the debut of "Texas" and the scaling back of AW from 90 to 60 minutes, on August 4, 1980 "Noonday on 8" moved from 12:30-1, to 12:00-12:30, so it could air "The Doctors" (moving from 2:00 to 12:30 on NBC) at 12:30. WGAL's noon news has been on at that time ever since, which meant that the Harrisburg area never got to see shows like Just Men!, Go!, and SP.
WGAL would also occasionally pre-empt some or all of the 10:00-11:00 hour as well, in the '80s.
WHTM was pretty good at carrying the morning lineup on ABC up until about 1988 or 1989, when they started airing "Family Medical Center" for a short time at noon on or around the time that Ryan's Hope left the airwaves. They carried MG90 from its premiere up until September, when "Trump Card" debuted at noon. When that show tanked in midseason, "People's Court" got the timeslot. MG did come back on 27 however, for the last month of its existence.
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[quote name=\'mitchgroff\' date=\'Sep 14 2005, 05:44 PM\']
KYW, then an NBC affiliate owned by Group W, would air games all over the place. I have vague memories of seeing SP airing at 3pm, and I don't think KYW had noon news, so they would air games in that slot as well.
My game show memory starts right about 1986 or 1987, so I don't remember what our ABC affils from Harrisburg (WHTM) and Philly (WPVI) carried in daytime games. I do remember watching Match Game for parts of its run on WHTM, though. I don't remember seeing Brucie or Double Talk though.
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KYW Philly aired People are Talking at 10AM EST for most of the 80s(the Philly version of which had Maury Povich and Richard Bey as hosts before they hit it big, while the Boston version of the franchise had Tom Bergeron hosting a decade before his Squares gig began). KYW aired Scrabble/Super Password/Daytime WOF from 3-4:30PM from 9/16/85-9/2/88; Scrabble and WOF continued airing on KYW through Summer 1989(the end of Rolf's run). NBC $otC aired at 3PM from Jan-Sep 1985 and that was all KYW aired of it. Classic Concentration didn't air on KYW until 1992 when the show was in perpetual reruns. KYW didn't air NBC Win Lose or Draw until January 1989.
WPVI didn't air any ABC daytime game shows after dropping Feud in June 1983. WTAF(now WTXF Fox) aired it for part of its run after that.
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[quote name=\'zachhoran\' date=\'Sep 14 2005, 07:52 PM\']
WPVI didn't air any ABC daytime game shows after dropping Feud in June 1983. WTAF(now WTXF Fox) aired it for part of its run after that.
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I may have asked you this before.........(Then) WTAF aired Feud at noon for that summer of '83. Was it the network feed, or were shows on a one-day delay?
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[quote name=\'aaron sica\' date=\'Sep 14 2005, 07:43 PM\'](Then) WTAF aired Feud at noon for that summer of '83. Was it the network feed, or were shows on a one-day delay?
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Chances are it's live -- indy stations that carry network shows often get it either off the feed, off the nearest affiliate carrying the show (especially since Philly is close to New York), or, in some cases, carry it delayed via film or tape.
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[quote name=\'aaron sica\' date=\'Sep 14 2005, 07:43 PM\'][quote name=\'zachhoran\' date=\'Sep 14 2005, 07:52 PM\']
WPVI didn't air any ABC daytime game shows after dropping Feud in June 1983. WTAF(now WTXF Fox) aired it for part of its run after that.
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I may have asked you this before.........(Then) WTAF aired Feud at noon for that summer of '83. Was it the network feed, or were shows on a one-day delay?
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I don't even recall seeing Feud on WTAF, but heard it from one of the NJ/PA folks here. WTAF aired Time Machine and Your NUmber's Up the same day WMGM NBC Atlantic City aired it(KYW never did air either one). WMGM Channel 40 aired all ABC game shows from the last two years of Dawson Feud through Bargain Hunters.
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Whenever a station runs a strip on a one-day delay, the Friday show always airs on Monday. WBBM does that today with "Guiding Light," which they air as the sacrificial lamb to Oprah at 9 a.m. while beginning their "Judge Judy" quadruple pump at 2 p.m., the feed time for "GL."
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I would have thought an O&O could have gotten an advance feed (or even a copy of the master tape). In the '80s, WCBS would show the same "Tattletales" at noon that the rest of the country got at 4pm.
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[quote name=\'Jimmy Owen\' date=\'Sep 15 2005, 02:13 PM\']I would have thought an O&O could have gotten an advance feed (or even a copy of the master tape). In the '80s, WCBS would show the same "Tattletales" at noon that the rest of the country got at 4pm.
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The flagship station of the CBS network--of course they'd have the tape there ready for airing. If the tape room at the CBS Broadcast Center served both network and WCBS master controls, they could've just left it on the VTR after rewinding the WCBS play if they could.
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[quote name=\'uncamark\' date=\'Sep 15 2005, 01:57 PM\']Whenever a station runs a strip on a one-day delay, the Friday show always airs on Monday. WBBM does that today with "Guiding Light," which they air as the sacrificial lamb to Oprah at 9 a.m. while beginning their "Judge Judy" quadruple pump at 2 p.m., the feed time for "GL."
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Certainly makes sense that the one-day delay covers the fact that they're not showing it with the network feed (and couldn't get an advance feed). But WBBM's one-day delaying of CBS' morning offerings from 1/4/82 to summer 1986 didn't make sense--as they were shown later than their network feeds (PYRAMID and CP/PYL/CS86 delayed by one hour *and* one day; TPiR delayed by one day and five hours). And Jimmy's point is well-taken that WCBS would air TT same-day (four hours earlier than most of the network), while WBBM would delay it by a day (but run it at the same time).
As an aside, WBBM never ran the full hour FFC eps; they only ran the second half-hour (after TPiR).
Or were you not talking to me? :)
Doug -- and the countdown to 1500 continues
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[quote name=\'SRIV94\' date=\'Sep 15 2005, 12:30 PM\']But WBBM's one-day delaying of CBS' morning offerings from 1/4/82 to summer 1986 didn't make sense--as they were shown later than their network feeds...
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Maybe they were worried about the ability of their master control operators to successfully perform the "delay" operations, and they wanted a one-day cushion just in case someone forgot to hit "record" and they had to request a refeed from CBS, or whatever.
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I'm pretty sure KCNC runs GL at 9 respectively.
I know WCBS does take GL at 10am local time before TPIR, so I am beginning to wonder if GL might not be fed out by the network in that hour. (I dont' have access to a CBS feed chart to know this for sure, but its a suspicion)
Remember, there is NO Mountain time zone feed of CBS, so KCNC either has to delay out the previous day's feed or take an early feed. Considering WBBM also does take it as 9 am local time as well
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[quote name=\'Terry K\' date=\'Sep 16 2005, 03:13 AM\']I know WCBS does take GL at 10am local time before TPIR, so I am beginning to wonder if GL might not be fed out by the network in that hour. (I dont' have access to a CBS feed chart to know this for sure, but its a suspicion)
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I don't think it's too bad a suspicion, considering I can think of at least two other CBS stations that air GL at 10am (KYW in Philly, WYOU in Scranton). Among other oddities, (and it's the only one on the East Coast I know of that does this), WRAL in Raleigh airs Y&R from 4pm-5pm.
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I remember going to my grandparents' house in northern PA over Christmas breaks. They live in McKean County, which is interestingly enough in the Buffalo, NY DMA. So WGRZ there aired a lot of shows I never saw anywhere else
I was never fond of the Buffalo stations. There were a lot of pre-emptions on those stations - especially in the late '70s. The original "Card Sharks" wasn't picked up by WGRZ until well into the first year of its run. "All-Star Secrets" was never aired on that station. WKBW, the ABC station, never ran the 12 noon show after 1976, meaning the last few months of "Let's Make a Deal" and the last couple years of "$20,000 Pyramid" were never carried.
Some of those shows did come into the area on International Cable - one of those stations picked up a distant feed.
As a game show fan, the worst thing WGRZ did occured in spring 1976. They were carrying a 60-minute version of "Dinah" at 9, followed by the NBC lineup at 10. All of a sudden one week they started airing a 90-minute version of "Dinah", taking out "Celebrity Sweepstakes" in the process. It was still carried in Rochester, but we didn't get Rochester added to our cable until the late '70s. Luckily, when NBC moved "Sweepstakes" to 10:30 in the summer we got it back, as "Sanford and Son" reruns were then blocked out.
In the '80s, we never got "Just Men" or "The New Battlestars". So I was never able to see the episodes of "Battlestars" that I saw in person.
In August 1985, WIVB, the CBS station picked up "Sally Jesse Raphael" at 10:30 - so they went from "Pyramid" to "Raphael" (and at that time I never even knew who she was) to "Price". Kind of an odd placement for the talk show. Luckily, "Press Your Luck" was still available on a Toronto station - that is until CBS changed the time slot in January 1986!
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[quote name=\'trainman\' date=\'Sep 16 2005, 12:28 AM\']Maybe they were worried about the ability of their master control operators to successfully perform the "delay" operations, and they wanted a one-day cushion just in case someone forgot to hit "record" and they had to request a refeed from CBS, or whatever.
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You could be on to something. Although, with two chances to get TPiR same-day (feed at 10AM CT for the East/Midwest/South and 12N CT for the West Coast), theoretically TPiR didn't necessarily have to be delayed by a day (since they were showing it at 3PM).
Personally, what I would've done is kept TPiR at 10AM CT with the rest of the network and delay CBS' 9AM/9:30 CT offerings to after the sudsers (and again, you'd have two chances to get those offerings for same-day airing).
Doug -- and the countdown to 1500 continues
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I posted this to Alt-TV-GS Back in July 1997.....regarding the Miami GS Scene, which, back in the day, sucked....
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
I can't speak for the seventies, for i moved to South Florida in 1978,
but I can personally attest to the LACK of network games that South
Florida affiliates would show.....I remember taking family vacations
back to New York (where I'm from) and not wanting to go do anything at
all if it interfered with a game show that i could not watch at
home......
For years the NBC affil (at the time, WCKT/WSVN 7) rarely aired any
10:30 am shows, nor did any Noon shows air because of the news.....this
means we never saw Go!, Just Men, the New Battlestars, the New
Blockbusters, Super Password, Hot Potato, or the 1st few years of Sale
of the Century.....they also did not air Wordplay, Scrabble (when it
took over the 12:30pm spot from Wordplay), or Match Game/Hollywood
Squares Hour, but thankfully the cable at the time picked up the West
Palm Beach affil , WPTV5, and they did air those....
In addition, the CBS affil (again, at the time WTVJ4), never aired Child
's Play, Press Your Luck, or new Card Sharks) and for many years didn't
air Pyramid at 10am....what made it worse was for a few years, they
would opt to run reruns of the Big Valley instead!
Slowly, they would trot out more network stuff, and when the
affiliations switched around at the beginning of 1989, everybody aired
everything, with the exception of Super Password (News was and continues
to be big in Miami!)
we did see our share of Syndie games, for that 's what both channels for
a while aired in place of the network games, which always seemed wierd
to me (preempting a game for another one, which in most cases was, a
weaker one! Strike it Rich, new Break the Bank, new Crosswits)....at
least the affils (channel 4 in particular) did air nighttime Card Sharks
and nighttime Sale of the Century, which meant us die hards did get some
fix of a show we couldn't see in the mornings!
Also, as far as the $20,000 Pyramid was concerned, I don't remember WPLG
airing the daytime version, but I do remember them airing the $25000
pyramid with Bill Cullen every Saturday night at 7:30 (going up against
Hee Haw and Sha Na Na!) for a time, they aired TTTT with Robin Ward at
this slot as well....
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[quote name=\'SRIV94\' date=\'Sep 15 2005, 02:30 PM\']As an aside, WBBM never ran the full hour FFC eps; they only ran the second half-hour (after TPiR).
Or were you not talking to me? :)
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At this point, I'm not really sure. :)
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If they could make more money and pull better numbers from that than the network compensation fee and maybe a minute of ad time within the show, there was no choice.
Just wanted to bump this up to ask one more thing about this: were the networks at all concerned when affiliates started pre-empting programming? Is there any way the networks could have made it more lucrative for an affiliate to carry their programming rather than a syndicated show, or were they at the limit - i.e. is there only so far the networks can go with this and still make a profit themselves?
I guess this question could also apply to today's daytime schedules as well. Any thoughts?
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I remember once when I spoke to the progmam director in Eastern Iowa at KWWL NBC, he told me that they love game shows and they perform very well. Therefore, we rarely had any pre-emptions of the NBC line up. The only thing they did was flip flop Wheel of Fortune and whatever game aired at 11:30 CST. I guess WOF was a better lead in for their noon news than Wordplay.
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Your nomenclature is all messed up. A pre-emption is when an episode of Card Sharks isn't shown because Reagan was shot, or because of local news coverage. Either the network or a local station can pre-empt a show. Not clearing a show means a local station's management has decided that you're not going to see the next n weeks of Card Sharks and will see Donahue instead. The clearance level, along with the national ratings, are taken into account when deciding to renew a show.
Also, I am unaware of pilots being fed to stations for their approval in clearing a show. In the case of our show the "pilot" was taped the Friday before the debut, too late to feed to affiliates for their approval. Pilots were tested by the networks but affiliates were not involved.
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[quote name=\'bellbm\' date=\'Sep 19 2005, 08:47 AM\']I remember once when I spoke to the progmam director in Eastern Iowa at KWWL NBC, he told me that they love game shows and they perform very well. Therefore, we rarely had any pre-emptions of the NBC line up.
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I have very vivid memories of watching "Super Password" on KWWL during visits to my grandparents in the Iowa City area (it wasn't cleared in Tampa, so getting to see it was a rare treat). I remember KWWL's station IDs back in those days, with video of the water towers of communities in their coverage area.
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I remember KWWL's station IDs back in those days, with video of the water towers of communities in their coverage area.
Those were actually al Qaeda training videos.
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Here is my info on pre-emptions thru the years:
In Michigan , our CBS station WKZO-TV (now WWMT) Kalamazoo carried every CBS game show, including the original Password (they also aired the color reruns from 1967-70,before ABC revived Password), TJW, TPIR and MG. The Lansing CBS station, WJIM-TV (now WLNS) usually bumped Tattletales ,both versions except for a time when it aired at 11am in 1975 and later the last 1 1/2 years of MG'77/'78/'79 were not aired and Body Language wasn't aired on WLNS and neither was the last PYL's in 1986.
WOOD -TV 8 NBC Grand Rapids did not air the 12:30 or 1:30 NBC shows due to local news and Merv Griffin before he moved to CBS to face Carson, or the original MG. In the 1970's and 1980's they bumped various shows including The Gong Show,(although WOOD did air the night version), MGHS and SP.
WILX-TV Lansing bumped the NBC AM game shows from 1959-70. I know Matt Ottinger remembers that like I do, because of WILX's shared time arrangement with WKAR-TV (then WMSB)Michigan State University's NET/PBS station on Channel 10 from 3/1959-9/1972. So they signed on at 7am with The Today Show and then at 9am WMSB came on with local and NET/PBS shows like Mr. Rogers and Sesame Street then back to WILX for NBC's soaps and also for You Don't Say and the original MG and various syndie shows and later the local and NBC news and then back to WMSB and tehn back to WILX for NBC shows like Laugh-In or Jeannie and then sign off after Johnny Carson. There were no games on 10 from NBC from 9/1969 when YDS and the original MG were canned until the summer of 1970 when the original Concentration, Hollywood Squares and Jeopardy! were on a tape delay from 3-4:30 when Mike Douglas came on,but the original $OTC with Jack Kelly and later Joe Garagiola was not seen in Lansing until 9/1972,and The Who, What or Where Game with Art James was also not seen on WILX until 9/1972. The shared-time deal ended on 9/10/1972 when WILX went Full-Time NBC and WKAR-TV came back on 23. WILX carried all of NBC's games until 1979 when the new version of J! with Art Fleming moved in at noon, but Action News aired at the time, and the last year of Perry CS was not aired and neither was the last five months of P+(I would see them later on GSN). And I never got to see Just Men ! on WILX or WOOD due to news. Can someone tell me if that show still exists? I'd love to see GSn air it.
WJRT-TV Flint carried virtually all of ABC's shows, WZZM -TV Grand Rapids tape delayed Password and later Family Feud due to Eyewitness news, and WUHQ-TV (now WOTV) Battle Creek aired all of ABC's games as scheduled.
Then in 1983, I moved to Sacramento and here's the scoop on lineups here:
When I got here KCRA 3 aired WOF at 10 am, then TTD, and then The New Battlestars, which left the air a few weeks after I moved, and Dream House on a tape delay took over, but GO! came in October, bumping DH, and $OTC was on a tape delay due to a local talk show called Look Who's Talking . We also never got to see Your Number's UP or Time Machine. KCRA did air Hot Potato and SP and also aired Fantasy and later MGHS on a one-week tape delay. We did not see the last episodes of MGHS in the summer of 1984 because KCRA wanted to do an afternoon version of Look Who's Talking,but it flopped.
Later , KCRA bumped CC but got it in 9/1989, and also bumped the last 1 1/2 years of $OTC and also Wordplay (Wordplay and CC were on what's now My58 in 1987,), and also TTTT90.
KXTV 10 carried all of the CBS games but in the early 1990's bumped TPIR, but public outcry reinstated TPIR. Now KXTV is ABC and when the Kings are on they often send J! to 1am and no WOF. At least I get WSBK Boston on Dish Network so I won't have to worry about pre-emptions.
KOVR 13 had many of the ABC games, but did not air MG90-91. I watched MG 90-91 on KGO in San Francisco on cable. KOVR is now CBS.
KDWB 20 in San Francisco (then KOFY TV 20) had many of the CBS and NBC games bumped by KPIX CBS 5 and KRON 4 , when they were with NBC in the 1970's and 1980's including, TPIR, PYL, CS-Eubanks, CC, BL, Fantasy,$25K Pyramid among others. Later KPIX began airing TPIR and KRON (which lost NBC to KNTV 11 and is now My TV 4 in the Bay Area) began airing CC.
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I grew up in Chicago area and had relatives from milwaukee and Milwaukee was bad for many years with preemptions. FI can only go back to the early 80s but WITI 6 didn't seem to have any game shows other than Price Is Right and $25,000 Pyramid at 8am central only starting in 1986 or so. They never had Child's Play, Body Language, Press Your Luck, Now You See It 1989, CBS Wheel of Fortune, Combs Feud, Eubanks Card Sharks. They had Donahue at 11 am and bumped Young and the Restless to 9 am. WTMJ 4 was bad with preemptions as they never had Win Lose or Draw daytime, Hit Man, Time Machine, Your Number's Up, Wordplay, MG/HS hour, didn't have Super Password until the last year or so and for years didn't carry the daytime Wheel. They usually in the mid 80s aired reruns such as Little House on the Prarie, Magnum PI, Quincy and a few others. I don't think Milwaukee had any independents picking stuff up until the early 90s when then independednt now CBS WDJT 58 picked up Family Feud, Scattegories, Scrabble 93 and a few others, although I believe WCGV 24 may have aired some network shows in 1986 or so.
As for Chicago in 1979-80 WMAQ aired Hollywood Squares and then Password Plus at 3pm when they had 11:30 am news and they were airing Wink Martindale's High Rollers at 10 am pushing Wheel to 3:30 pm.
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One Cleveland television station decision I'll always wonder about is the early 1987 removal of The $25,000 Pyramid so then-CBS affiliate WJW-TV 8 could present reruns of Maude each weekday morning at 10:00.
Dumping Card Sharks a couple of months later for The $1,000,000 Chance Of A Lifetime, however, I had no problem with.
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I've recently learned of a very interesting programming move our NBC station made. In the early-to-mid-80s, they aired the news at noon, but on Fridays, they aired "Hot Potato", and maybe some of the other NBC noontime shows. Sooner or later, I might have to make a trip to the library.
I know our CBS affil. never aired 80s Pyramid, PYL, or Body Language. They aired the first season of 80s Tattletales, then took it off.
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[quote name=\'chrispw1\' post=\'138705\' date=\'Nov 23 2006, 09:55 PM\']
and they were airing Wink Martindale's High Rollers at 10 am pushing Wheel to 3:30 pm.
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Which was a move I never got. Why bother moving WoF from an established network slot in favor of a syndie show that could've just filled that early afternoon hole (also meaning you would never have to insert a localized voiceover over the end credits of ClCn in case they billboarded that WoF was coming up next)?
At least WMAQ didn't delay it by a day (in keeping with some elements of this thread I mentioned long ago).
And Brandon, congrats on 4000.
Doug
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[quote name=\'SRIV94\' post=\'138756\' date=\'Nov 24 2006, 10:17 PM\']
And Brandon, congrats on 4000.
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What the?...I never even noticed.
Thanks!
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[quote name=\'fostergray82\' post=\'138757\' date=\'Nov 24 2006, 09:21 PM\']
[quote name=\'SRIV94\' post=\'138756\' date=\'Nov 24 2006, 10:17 PM\']
And Brandon, congrats on 4000.
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What the?...I never even noticed.
Thanks!
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You need one of my patented "and the countdown to xxxx continues." :-D
Doug
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In Harrisburg, up to about 1989 or so, WHP-TV 21 (CBS) was pretty good about airing the 10am-11am hour. They never filled that hour with anything local, but starting that fall, "Sally Jessy Raphael" took that spot.
When the noon news on 21 ceased to exist, they started airing the CBS "Family Feud" at noon until its exit from the CBS schedule in 1993 (when it expanded to an hour, they only aired the last half hour).
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Why am I so glad I live in an area that doesn't pay much attention to preemptions?
The only spot that I know for sure was preempted was the 4 PM CBS slot. I can only remember from 1986, but I know that Press Your Luck didn't air at 4- I'm pretty sure WCBS had it on at 12:30 (with LMAD on before it).
Not sure if that was the case when Tattletales or Body Language was airing in the slot.
(For some reason, in 1987 I think that ABC might have been airing something at 10 AM, which was where WABC paired Jeopardy! with another one season wonder, Split Second- continuing the trend they had with Lange's Name That Tune, Sale of the Century (once they got it from WWOR), and the Rafferty CS. Can anyone confirm that?)
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[quote name=\'PYLdude\' post=\'138787\' date=\'Nov 25 2006, 03:04 PM\']
Why am I so glad I live in an area that doesn't pay much attention to preemptions?
The only spot that I know for sure was preempted was the 4 PM CBS slot. I can only remember from 1986, but I know that Press Your Luck didn't air at 4- I'm pretty sure WCBS had it on at 12:30 (with LMAD on before it).
Not sure if that was the case when Tattletales or Body Language was airing in the slot.
(For some reason, in 1987 I think that ABC might have been airing something at 10 AM, which was where WABC paired Jeopardy! with another one season wonder, Split Second- continuing the trend they had with Lange's Name That Tune, Sale of the Century (once they got it from WWOR), and the Rafferty CS. Can anyone confirm that?)
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You are lucky living in an O&O area - hardly any (if at all) pre-emptions.
CBS affils typically aired the noon show at either noon or 4pm - WCBS aired that show at noon, going back at least as far as "Love of Life" and then to "One Day at a Time", then "Up to The Minute", "Tattletales", "Body Language" and finally "Press Your Luck". The last CBS show that they aired at 4pm was MG79.
I will try to find a 1987 TVG and see what was listed on WABC from the 10-11am hour as well.
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[quote name=\'aaron sica\' post=\'138788\' date=\'Nov 25 2006, 03:11 PM\']
I will try to find a 1987 TVG and see what was listed on WABC from the 10-11am hour as well.
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Okay...I figure Oprah started out the year in the slot, then when the fall came around they moved J! to it.
I appreciate that.