The Game Show Forum
The Game Show Forum => The Big Board => Topic started by: cyberjoek on July 10, 2003, 08:32:09 PM
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ok, it's summer, it's past the year 2k, so it must be Big Brother time. This years twist is the \"eX-factor\" (that is the way they want press to capitolize it), where 5 ex -boyfriends and -girlfriends were introduced into the house at the end of the first episode. My question is did anyone here watch besides me? If so what did you think?
-Joe Kavanagh
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[quote name=\'cyberjoek\' date=\'Jul 10 2003, 07:32 PM\'] ok, it's summer, it's past the year 2k, so it must be Big Brother time. This years twist is the "eX-factor" (that is the way they want press to capitolize it), where 5 ex -boyfriends and -girlfriends were introduced into the house at the end of the first episode. My question is did anyone here watch besides me? If so what did you think?
-Joe Kavanagh [/quote]
I haven't watched it past the first show the first season. Why won't this beast die?
Brandon Brooks
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[quote name=\'Brandon Brooks\' date=\'Jul 10 2003, 07:45 PM\'] [quote name=\'cyberjoek\' date=\'Jul 10 2003, 07:32 PM\'] ok, it's summer, it's past the year 2k, so it must be Big Brother time. This years twist is the "eX-factor" (that is the way they want press to capitolize it), where 5 ex -boyfriends and -girlfriends were introduced into the house at the end of the first episode. My question is did anyone here watch besides me? If so what did you think?
-Joe Kavanagh [/quote]
I haven't watched it past the first show the first season. Why won't this beast die?
Brandon Brooks [/quote]
Moonves is immortal.
..oh, you meant BB? Sorry.
And no, I don't watch it. Never have, never will.
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Is this show still on? That is a shock to me. Watching this crap is as fun as having your wisdom teeth pulled...and I know how that feels.
It is shows like these that make me wish that whoever devised this type of \"reality TV\" be dragged out into the street and shot.
The Inquisitive One
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I'm watching. I find it compelling for the same reason I like Survivor-- the psychology is fascinating. In the case of Big Brother, as the season progresses the manipulation and maneuvering becomes increasingly intense and dynamic. It's pure game.
The \"X-factor\" this year bothers me, because it pollutes the game. The great thing about past Big Brothers is that no contestants knew each other beforehand-- they all started with a clean slate. So we get to see the relationships and incidents which influence players' game plans. But with all the pre-existing baggage in the house this season, there's going to be a lot going on that has nothing to do with what's happened in the house. As a viewer, I find that far less interesting.
I expect to be blogging about Big Brother throughout the season at Static Zombie. My thoughts on the first episode can be found here.
- Peter
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[quote name=\'Peter Sarrett\' date=\'Jul 10 2003, 06:26 PM\'] I'm watching. I find it compelling for the same reason I like Survivor-- the psychology is fascinating. In the case of Big Brother, as the season progresses the manipulation and maneuvering becomes increasingly intense and dynamic. It's pure game.
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Gotta agree. I haven't watched the last couple of series because of conflicts with other programming and such, but I've watched both episodes this time out so far, and I set a season pass on the Tivo. It'll fill the time adequately until the regular shows get through summer hiatus.
The ex- thing is interesting, because the scheming is sprouting early BECAUSE people automatically know and like/dislike each other. It will be interesting to see if the First Eight manage to hold together and eject the Other Five. I would imagine that will depend on them maintaining HOH as long as that takes.
(And no, BB is not a game show.)
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I am watching. It seems like there will be some fun conflicts among this group. Let's be honest, we like nasty people wo are willing to scheme to get ahead. This group has some real tight asses who are ready to sell grandma into slavery if it will get them that private bedroom.
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Why won't this die??? This is the answer I gave Steve to a similar question he asked on his site: People literally want to see people getting it on -- and if you want to use that in both sexual and fight terms, that's fine -- both apply. This thing needed to die when the idiot played with a knife with another contestant and got DQed in series 2.
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I was told by a very good source at CBS that these shows (especially Survivor) will keep on airing until it doesn't sell anymore.
Of course, that's pretty obvious
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The \"X-factor\" this year bothers me, because it pollutes the game.
I haven't seen the new one yet, but from the sounds of things I agree with you completely. There was something simple and almost innocent about the original structure of the game. Since then, probably more than any other reality show (even Survivor), they just seem to change the rules as they go along in order to create more of....whatever it is they seem to think they need more of.
By comparison, The Amazing Race keeps rolling along with essentially the same structure they've had from the beginning. Drama, excitement, tension, cute boys and girls embarrassing themselves on TV and the whole, big wide colorful world as their \"set\", not to mention an actual competition instead of a cliquish popularity contest. The fact that this show struggles while other much worse shows click is one thing that disappoints me greatly about American viewing habits.
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The Amazing Race struggles because it's not compelling television. I watch it, but I'm always struck by how much better-produced Survivor is. The activities in The Amazing Race are rarely very interesting for viewers to watch. Do we really want to watch contestants wash bundles of dirty clothes at a public laundry, or ride an elephant? The competitions in Survivor are generally very well-constructed and interesting to watch. We see the entire competition (or, in the case of endurance challenges, all the meaningful parts), not a fragmentary jump-cut montage as in The Amazing Race. And the challenges in The Amazing Race are mundane and uninspired-- deliver X to Y; search through X for your clue; etc. If the challenges were mini-competitions and puzzles, as opposed to tasks they just have to complete, I think the show would be much more fun.
The two shows also have a different approach to letting us get to know the contestants. One of Survivor's strengths is it's terrific use of interview/confessional segments, where the players talk about what's been going on, their strategy, how they're feeling, etc. The Amazing Race uses almost none of that, preferring to let us glean what we can from the interaction of the partners and teams with only a smattering of interviews. The result is that we really don't know these players as well as we do the Survivor folks, and consequently we care less about them.
Plus, after the first season The Amazing Race has been structured as 13 mini-races rather than one continuous race. The players are invariably bunched up at the start of each leg as they wait for flights or a particular activity to open up. That means each episode is up for grabs, but it also rendered the whole \"strategy\" of when to use the Fast Forward moot. You can't get meaningfully ahead in the long term anymore.
I've always felt that The Amazing Race has potential that's largely unrealized. Its very structure weakens it. The most interesting parts, I think, are when the teams interact. But the nature of the game is that it's a race that keeps the teams apart.
- Peter
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I am not getting involved this year. They can have their alcohol-soaked frat party presided over by Miss Clueless. I just am not going.
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I think season one will always be the best. The house guests, the games and even the theme music was my favorite. I've watched it this past week and I think the X (EX) factor is cool. it will definately stir things up in the house and that will make for some good Television. I pretty much skipped over seasons 2 and 3 with the exception of a few episodes here and there. I just couln't get into it. But I've made an attempt at season 4 and I think I'll keep tuning in this summer to see what happens with the Ex's. I anticipate some good fights
John
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Well, I've been watching the show ever since season 2, and, to me, it's still compelling TV (then again, there ain't much else on during the summer).
I may be one of the only people that doesn't like the \"X\" factor, though; the original formula for the show was fine as is, and, trust me, there were plenty of fights, romances, friendships, whatever to go around with just the 12 total strangers!
Also, where do they find all these whiney people? I thought it was hilarious when they were complaining after losing meat in a food competition; my mom turned to me and said, \"They should go on 'Survivor;' then, they'll know what it's really like to be without food!\" Not only that, but that girl Allison is getting on my nerves: boyfriend this, boyfriend that, my life sucks, I want to be faithful to my boyfriend who'll break up with me but I'll still flirt with my ex anyway.
However, that getting-on-the-nerves part is part of what I think keeps the show compelling; you want to watch just to see if that person you hate finally gets what's coming to them! The same goes for \"Survivor\" and all reality shows: negative attention is just as effective, if not more so, than positive.
As far as keeping the show on the air goes, it'll be around for a while: it's airing in a prime spot (summertime) and still pulls in pretty decent ratings. A lot of people say that three eps. a week is overkill, but, considering the show airs three months a year, I think it's far from!
I think CBS did a good job with retooling the show for BB2, taking some elements that obviously worked with \"Survivor.\" Trust me, folks, this is one of a lot of people's guilty pleasures (at least, among people I know), so I don't think it's going anywhere anytime soon!
Anthony
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Peter Sarrett wrote:
The Amazing Race struggles because it's not compelling television. I watch it, but I'm always struck by how much better-produced Survivor is. The activities in The Amazing Race are rarely very interesting for viewers to watch. Do we really want to watch contestants wash bundles of dirty clothes at a public laundry, or ride an elephant? The competitions in Survivor are generally very well-constructed and interesting to watch. We see the entire competition (or, in the case of endurance challenges, all the meaningful parts), not a fragmentary jump-cut montage as in The Amazing Race. And the challenges in The Amazing Race are mundane and uninspired-- deliver X to Y; search through X for your clue; etc. If the challenges were mini-competitions and puzzles, as opposed to tasks they just have to complete, I think the show would be much more fun.
But what about The Mole? I'd argue that it has the same production advantages you attribute to Survivor -- we get to see the major portions of all the games, they're (usually) well-thought-out, we get to see the contestants in the \"confessional\" room, and there's an objective element of elimination as opposed to the popularity contest that is Survivor. Yet The Mole hasn't succeeded in the ratings, and Survivor keeps chugging along with exceptional ratings for the genre.
Indeed, I don't watch Survivor at all; one episode was enough to turn me off in utter disgust. The feigned \"reality\" of it all, and the horrible elimination format which allows weaker players to gang up on the stronger (a la \"Weakest Link\") bother me to no end. (Ditto \"Big Brother\".) On The Mole, they're quite clear that the fixing of the games is the whole point of the show.
I'm inclined to agree with Matt on this one. I see the Amazing Race as \"Beat the Clock\" meets \"Ultra Quiz\", with quite a bit of fun in the process. Now if only Jon and Kelly could get eliminated....
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The failure of The Mole mystifies me-- I thought it was fabulous. It still had room for improvement, however, notably in the interview department. One of the great things about Survivor is that the interviews are just beatifully shot. They frame the player against good background scenery and edit the conversations extremely well to show the most interesting nuggets. The Mole confessionals are horribly lit and rarely offer comments of real insight or interest. The interviews are shot in hotels and don't probe very deeply at all into the player's thoughts. The Survivor interviews are in-situ-- we have the illusion of a player taking a few moments from his normal in-game day to talk to us-- while the Mole and Amazing Race interviews are in comfy zones during breaks and convey no sense of the game still going on. I think they'd be more interesting if they were shot at some of the locations where the activities are held. That's virtually impossible with The Amazing Race, but would be extremely easy with The Mole.
I also wish The Amazing Race showed us more of what goes on during the pit stops, while players are socializing with each other. I'd like to see the contestants in these more relaxed moments, instead of always on the go.
- Peter
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The funny thing is that the mole doesn't do that badly in the ratings, better then Amazing Race does. Why ABC keeps canceling it is beond me...
-Joe Kavanagh
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Someone's already gotten kicked out the house for throwing furniture. That makes for compelling television, doesn't it?
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I watched the first ep of this season's \"Big Brother\"--mostly to find out what the \"x\" was--but that's it for me. A big, fat \"Who cares?\"
\"Race\" is enjoyable, though Peter's analysis above is thorough--and, I hope, read by \"AR\"s producers. I really disliked the first \"Mole,\" but enjoyed season 2 a lot. The games were compelling, the show was classy all around.
-C
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Oh, and they've already had an explusion...following in the footsteps of Justin Sedik from BB2, Scott was ejected from the house on Sat for a violent outburst (tossing furniture and initially refusing to come to the Diary Room when summoned)...unlike his predecessor, however, he apologized to the other housemates, citing a condition that causes his erratic ways.
Wonder how they'll handle his departure on Tue's show...
Chuck Donegan (The Mildly-Curious \"Chuckie Baby\")
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[quote name=\'ChuckNet\' date=\'Jul 13 2003, 10:38 PM\'] Oh, and they've already had an explusion...following in the footsteps of Justin Sedik from BB2, Scott was ejected from the house on Sat for a violent outburst (tossing furniture and initially refusing to come to the Diary Room when summoned)...unlike his predecessor, however, he apologized to the other housemates, citing a condition that causes his erratic ways.
Wonder how they'll handle his departure on Tue's show...
Chuck Donegan (The Mildly-Curious "Chuckie Baby") [/quote]
I dunno, but I SURE WANT TO THANK YOU for ruining it for the rest of us.
(Killfiles. My Kingdom for killfiles. This wouldn't have happened if I had a killfile.)
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[quote name=\'clemon79\' date=\'Jul 14 2003, 01:17 AM\'] [quote name=\'ChuckNet\' date=\'Jul 13 2003, 10:38 PM\'] Oh, and they've already had an explusion...following in the footsteps of Justin Sedik from BB2, Scott was ejected from the house on Sat for a violent outburst (tossing furniture and initially refusing to come to the Diary Room when summoned)...unlike his predecessor, however, he apologized to the other housemates, citing a condition that causes his erratic ways.
Wonder how they'll handle his departure on Tue's show...
Chuck Donegan (The Mildly-Curious "Chuckie Baby") [/quote]
I dunno, but I SURE WANT TO THANK YOU for ruining it for the rest of us.
(Killfiles. My Kingdom for killfiles. This wouldn't have happened if I had a killfile.) [/quote]
Um, Chris, Your anger should be at David, Steve Beverly, Jam! Showbiz report, CBS Press Express, and the production staff of big brother, they all pointed it out in public before Chuck.
-Joe Kavanagh
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[quote name=\'cyberjoek\' date=\'Jul 13 2003, 11:21 PM\'] Um, Chris, Your anger should be at David, Steve Beverly, Jam! Showbiz report, CBS Press Express, and the production staff of big brother, they all pointed it out in public before Chuck.
-Joe Kavanagh [/quote]
Um, no, just because they all spoiled it, doesn't mean Chuck needs to spread the virus here. Some of us don't need to scour for every ounce of TV news.
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Um, no, just because they all spoiled it, doesn't mean Chuck needs to spread the virus here. Some of us don't need to scour for every ounce of TV news.
Well, I'm sorry, but I didn't think there'd be any problem posting it here since it technically already \"aired\" (via the net).
Chuck Donegan (The Illustrious \"Chuckie Baby\")
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I'm with you on this one, Chuck. Who the hell needs to watch the show when you've got John Powell doing a great job keeping us informed?
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[quote name=\'ChuckNet\' date=\'Jul 14 2003, 09:58 AM\'] Well, I'm sorry, but I didn't think [/quote]
Damn skippy on that one.
since it technically already \"aired\" (via the net).
Other then \"as an extremely crappy excuse\", I don't see how you can make that claim. CBS's web site on the show doesn't say anything about anything that has happened past Friday's show. A working brain would figure out, I think, that if neither of the show's two main information outlets (the broadcast and the Web site) have made the information public, then there's a reason for that.
The fact is, you got a hold of this, and in your usual flat-out breakneck rush to be The First to post it here, you screwed up. Bottom line.
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Sorry you were spoiled, man...but it's mainstream news. It's not like a nomination or who wins HOH or Power of Veto...when someone is expelled in from the house, it becomes actual news. Actual news may spoil you, but I don't think it falls under the same category as say the Double Showcase Win of a few weeks ago.
The reason why the broadcast hasn't made it public is simple, they haven't had a broadcast since this happened on Saturday night. As for the website, I'm sure there is deep discussion as to what they will do or say about Scott and his problem. Perhaps they are consulting lawyers and wondering how much of his condition will be disclosed. It as valid a news story as when Justin was kicked out for holding the knife to Krista's neck. It's left the realm of game shows (or as the Professor calls them, game operas) and entered REAL LIFE. Once it does that, I think, all spoilers are off.
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Though this certainly falls into a gray area on the spoil-o-meter, I think the majority of us are siding with Chuck on this one. This is mainstream news, not something that some people had access to before other people did. We talk about mainstream news here. The fact that this fell naturally into the flow of the thread and wasn't a separate announcement didn't help matters. I think Chuck would have been smart enough to have put a new thread into Show Summaries.
If your enjoyment of The Julie Chen Show is somehow tarnished by knowing ahead of time that one of the pretty-boys had a hissy fit, I feel for you. On the other hand, my understanding is that a lot of Big Brother fans WANT to be alerted to things that happened in the house so they can see how the events are covered on the show. Either way, it's done, and at least 50% of your administrators do not see it as an egregious error on anybody's part.
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The fact is, you got a hold of this, and in your usual flat-out breakneck rush to be The First to post it here, you screwed up. Bottom line.
I've never rushed to be the first to post anything, and as for my \"screwing up\", I'll admit in retrospect that the nature of the post might have been better suited to the \"show spoilers/summaries\" section, but I didn't view it as being along the same lines as revealing who got voted off this wk, who won the $500K, etc...it just seemed like mainstream news to me, as well as others who've voiced their opinions in this thread.
Anyway, if I somehow ruined your enjoyment of Tue's ep, I apologize, but my intention was solely to inform those BB4 viewers who might not have heard about it...I know you're not gonna agree w/me, but I simply thought I was posting news that was more-or-less already out there, thus eliminating the need for spoilers.
Chuck Donegan (The Illustrious \"Chuckie Baby\")
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[quote name=\'Matt Ottinger\' date=\'Jul 14 2003, 01:26 PM\'] If your enjoyment of The Julie Chen Show is somehow tarnished by knowing ahead of time that one of the pretty-boys had a hissy fit, I feel for you. [/quote]
Whatever. I'm not all that worked up about it anymore, but I do take umbrage with the above quote, alone with David's quote about \"who the hell needs to watch the show when...\" Those two lines suggest that it's okay to spoil the show because you guys don't particularly care for it, and that's a load of Grade-A crap. Amazing Race doesn't particularly float my boat, but that doesn't give me carte blanche to blow a spoiler for you guys.
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Well, just to be my dumb self, the kick-out isn't exclusive to the net anymore. I just saw info of it on Entertainment Tonight. So for those complaining about spoiling it, the whole media is, so don't crash on whoever mentioned it for everyone else's actions.
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Yeah, they're just the latest of a bunch. For anyone who follows media, it's pretty much been all over the place. Probably didn't help CBS any that all the TV critics in the country are right there to report on it. Or maybe it does help them, I'm still a little suspicious that CBS and the producers actively seek out edgier contestants for the extra press it gives them when they boot 'em out. I'm virtually certain the underage housemate will be the next one to leave in a headline-making fashion.
As for my earlier comment, while it certainly was flippant, the \"I feel for you\" really was genuine. I honestly \"get\" the fact that material was spoiled. I meant to make that more clear.
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Those two lines suggest that it's okay to spoil the show because you guys don't particularly care for it, and that's a load of Grade-A crap.
Yeah, that's def not OK...for better or worse, I'm a semi-regular viewer of BB4 myself, and was just supplying info I didn't think would cause any problems by posting w/out spoilage.
As long as everything's cool now, though...could you pass the peace pipe my way? :-)
Chuck Donegan (The Illustrious \"Chuckie Baby\")
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[quote name=\'clemon79\' date=\'Jul 14 2003, 05:22 PM\'] [quote name=\'Matt Ottinger\' date=\'Jul 14 2003, 01:26 PM\'] If your enjoyment of The Julie Chen Show is somehow tarnished by knowing ahead of time that one of the pretty-boys had a hissy fit, I feel for you. [/quote]
Whatever. I'm not all that worked up about it anymore, but I do take umbrage with the above quote, alone with David's quote about \"who the hell needs to watch the show when...\" Those two lines suggest that it's okay to spoil the show because you guys don't particularly care for it, and that's a load of Grade-A crap. Amazing Race doesn't particularly float my boat, but that doesn't give me carte blanche to blow a spoiler for you guys. [/quote]
I honestly could go either way on this one. I understand both your points. I just wanted to add that sometimes certain areas of the net cause more stress then they are worth.
I remember back in the 80's before this internet thing caught on, I would look forward to my shows, enjoy my shows and then look forward to my shows again the next day. No Spolier crap, no over analyzing the same things over and over day in and day out to the point where I should be making an appointment to see a Psychiartist.
Before the internet TV used to be peaceful. You would look forward to a show, enjoy it and then not have to hammer out details about it inside your head 24/7. Newsgroups and Message Boards is one of the pleasures of the internet that has actually turned into a problem for many.
Do yourself a favor and every once in a while step away from these places for a few days. Television will become less like a job and actually seem enjoyable again.
John
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[quote name=\'davemackey\' date=\'Jul 13 2003, 04:09 PM\']Someone's already gotten kicked out the house for throwing furniture. That makes for compelling television, doesn't it?[/quote]
I hate to be a nit-pick but this post about the kick out came before Chuck's. Just FYI :-)
-Joe Kavanagh
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[quote name=\'cyberjoek\' date=\'Jul 14 2003, 09:56 PM\'] I hate to be a nit-pick [/quote]
Obviously not that much, or you wouldn't have done it.