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Author Topic: Buzzr aspect ratio  (Read 2590 times)

chris319

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Re: Buzzr aspect ratio
« Reply #15 on: June 13, 2022, 12:28:11 AM »
Recently (in the past few months or so), I've noticed more artifacts when the video has a lot of elements changing at once, like the bandwidth has gotten lower. Supermarket Sweep has always had its rough patches on that front, but now it's sometimes happening even on relatively static shows like Classic Concentration. I compared my antenna feed to the feed directly on Buzzr's website -- the artifacting isn't happening on buzzrtv.com, so it must be my affiliate.

I can tell you these subordinate programming services are very highly compressed.

snowpeck

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Re: Buzzr aspect ratio
« Reply #16 on: June 13, 2022, 02:13:29 PM »
If you are watching a TERRESTRIAL, OVER-THE-AIR BROADCAST feed of Buzzer, take note of the Buzzr logo in the lower right of the screen. If it looks perfectly circular to you then that casts suspicion on the KCOP.2 broadcast. If it looks narrow, it could be leaving Buzzr that way. In either case, please report here the logo's appearance along with the station's call letters, subchannel number and the station's city of license.
I normally watch the stream, but we get it here on WAGA 5.3 OTA and on cable as well. Just checked that feed and the aspect ratio looks perfectly fine to me. Round Buzzr logo and appropriately sized black bars on the side of the screen.

Co-owner, The Daytime TV Schedule Archive
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chris319

  • Executive Producer
  • Posts: 10233
Re: Buzzr aspect ratio
« Reply #17 on: June 13, 2022, 08:08:55 PM »
If you are watching a TERRESTRIAL, OVER-THE-AIR BROADCAST feed of Buzzer, take note of the Buzzr logo in the lower right of the screen. If it looks perfectly circular to you then that casts suspicion on the KCOP.2 broadcast. If it looks narrow, it could be leaving Buzzr that way. In either case, please report here the logo's appearance along with the station's call letters, subchannel number and the station's city of license.
I normally watch the stream, but we get it here on WAGA 5.3 OTA and on cable as well. Just checked that feed and the aspect ratio looks perfectly fine to me. Round Buzzr logo and appropriately sized black bars on the side of the screen.

How is your receiver set up? Some receivers elongate 4:3 content to 16:9 so everything would appear normal if that is the case.

I watched some '70s TTTT last night on Buzzr OTA. My TV set is configured to NOT elongate 4:3 content to 16:9. The Buzzr logo was egg shaped, compressed horizontally, with excessively wide horizontal blanking on the left and right. The commercials were reduced to a 16:9 postage stamp in the center of the screen with excessive horizontal and vertical blanking.

These problems did not exist about a year ago.

snowpeck

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Re: Buzzr aspect ratio
« Reply #18 on: June 13, 2022, 08:24:11 PM »
If you are watching a TERRESTRIAL, OVER-THE-AIR BROADCAST feed of Buzzer, take note of the Buzzr logo in the lower right of the screen. If it looks perfectly circular to you then that casts suspicion on the KCOP.2 broadcast. If it looks narrow, it could be leaving Buzzr that way. In either case, please report here the logo's appearance along with the station's call letters, subchannel number and the station's city of license.
I normally watch the stream, but we get it here on WAGA 5.3 OTA and on cable as well. Just checked that feed and the aspect ratio looks perfectly fine to me. Round Buzzr logo and appropriately sized black bars on the side of the screen.

How is your receiver set up? Some receivers elongate 4:3 content to 16:9 so everything would appear normal if that is the case.

I watched some '70s TTTT last night on Buzzr OTA. My TV set is configured to NOT elongate 4:3 content to 16:9. The Buzzr logo was egg shaped, compressed horizontally, with excessively wide horizontal blanking on the left and right. The commercials were reduced to a 16:9 postage stamp in the center of the screen with excessive horizontal and vertical blanking.

These problems did not exist about a year ago.
The small TV I have in my home office doesn't have any settings to adjust aspect ratio (just a useless zoom option) so I was seeing it as it was being provided.
Co-owner, The Daytime TV Schedule Archive
My website: http://www.gregbrobeck.net
My board game collection: http://boardgamegeek.com/collection/user/snowpeck (recently passed the 100 mark!)

Pyramid80

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  • Posts: 483
Re: Buzzr aspect ratio
« Reply #19 on: June 13, 2022, 09:00:38 PM »
I watch Buzzr on KCOP channel 13.2 via Spectrum cable. Since I've retired from Rupert's evil empire I can't check the Buzzr downlink. Since some time in late 2021 the aspect ratio on Buzzr has been messed up. The logo in the lower right is supposed to be perfectly circular. It used to be perfect but since late last year it's been too narrow.

I have my TV set so that a show produced in 4:3 is displayed in 4:3 rather than being artificially stretched to 16:9. I want to see FF just as Paul Alter saw it. Buzzr is weird because so many shows are 4:3 but many commercials are produced in 16:9. I have a feeling somebody violated the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" rule and tried to "fix" something that wasn't broke and messed it up in the process. The challenge is to find out where in the chain the picture is being distorted; whether it's leaving the Buzzr plant that way or whether the problem is occurring on the receiving end.

If you are watching a TERRESTRIAL, OVER-THE-AIR BROADCAST feed of Buzzer, take note of the Buzzr logo in the lower right of the screen. If it looks perfectly circular to you then that casts suspicion on the KCOP.2 broadcast. If it looks narrow, it could be leaving Buzzr that way. In either case, please report here the logo's appearance along with the station's call letters, subchannel number and the station's city of license.

N.B. If you are watching a satellite or Internet feed of Buzzr, that is not a terrestrial over-the-air broadcast feed. If you are watching an OTA feed via cable, that counts as an OTA feed.
I sent you a PM, but passing this along, in case you didn’t see it.

I get Buzzr via xfinity cable through one of my local TV stations.  My TV is set to the 16:9 ratio, but when I go to the Buzzr channel, I see everything in the correct aspect ratio with black bars in the left and right.  No one is stretched out or anything and the Buzzr logo is perfectly round.  I have seen Buzzr itself actually goof on the ratio with Match Game Hollywood Squares being stretched to fit my entire screen without any black bars on the sides, but I knew that was Buzzr’s fault since the preceding and following shows were back to the correct aspect ratio.  That was a Buzzr goof though.  I hope this helps.

chris319

  • Executive Producer
  • Posts: 10233
Re: Buzzr aspect ratio
« Reply #20 on: June 13, 2022, 10:01:48 PM »
Quote
My TV is set to the 16:9 ratio

That's why everything looks "normal" to you. MG and MG/HS were produced in 4:3. That your receiver is elongating the picture masks the problem Buzzr is having. Which station and digital subchannel are you watching and what market is it?

Quote
The small TV I have in my home office doesn't have any settings to adjust aspect ratio (just a useless zoom option) so I was seeing it as it was being provided.

One possibility is that the receiver is elongating the picture in spite of the fact that there are no user settings to control it.

At my former station we had a pair of "professional" Sony OLED monitors which cost $3,000 apiece. These monitors did that exact thing: they made all of the incoming video 16:9 to fill up the screen and we had no control over it. This bit us in the ass many times because if a field camera was set to 4:3, we had no way of knowing it because these monitors artificially made the picture 16:9 and thus disguised the fact that the picture was coming in at 4:3, no matter how loudly the directors and T.D.'s screamed and hollered.

Eventually these two $3,000 monitors stopped working and were removed from service. Rather than try to fix them in house or send them back to Sony, poof! The monitors disappeared in a puff of smoke. Nobody knew where they were or what happened to them. $6,000 worth of capital equipment vanished into thin air. They did not have asset tags and there was probably no record of their serial numbers.

What makes this problem difficult to trace is that monitors can disguise these maladies. I suspect there is a problem at Buzzr judging from the fact that their commercials look different compared to programming.

Pyramid80

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Re: Buzzr aspect ratio
« Reply #21 on: June 14, 2022, 12:24:46 PM »
Quote
My TV is set to the 16:9 ratio

That's why everything looks "normal" to you. MG and MG/HS were produced in 4:3. That your receiver is elongating the picture masks the problem Buzzr is having. Which station and digital subchannel are you watching and what market is it?

Quote
The small TV I have in my home office doesn't have any settings to adjust aspect ratio (just a useless zoom option) so I was seeing it as it was being provided.

One possibility is that the receiver is elongating the picture in spite of the fact that there are no user settings to control it.

At my former station we had a pair of "professional" Sony OLED monitors which cost $3,000 apiece. These monitors did that exact thing: they made all of the incoming video 16:9 to fill up the screen and we had no control over it. This bit us in the ass many times because if a field camera was set to 4:3, we had no way of knowing it because these monitors artificially made the picture 16:9 and thus disguised the fact that the picture was coming in at 4:3, no matter how loudly the directors and T.D.'s screamed and hollered.

Eventually these two $3,000 monitors stopped working and were removed from service. Rather than try to fix them in house or send them back to Sony, poof! The monitors disappeared in a puff of smoke. Nobody knew where they were or what happened to them. $6,000 worth of capital equipment vanished into thin air. They did not have asset tags and there was probably no record of their serial numbers.

What makes this problem difficult to trace is that monitors can disguise these maladies. I suspect there is a problem at Buzzr judging from the fact that their commercials look different compared to programming.

I get Buzzr via KMSP-TV4 in the Twin Cities.  I don’t know what you mean by substation, but I’m guessing you mean it’s 9.4?  The main station is KMSP or channel 9.

All the Buzzr commercials look like 16:9 formats put into the 4:3 ratio, so basically all the commercials have proper aspects but with black bars on the side, making them look extra small.

chris319

  • Executive Producer
  • Posts: 10233
Re: Buzzr aspect ratio
« Reply #22 on: June 14, 2022, 01:16:28 PM »
KMSP channel 9 is divided into 4 subchannels, with Buzzr on channel 9.4.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KMSP-TV#KMSP-TV/WFTC_subchannels

How do shows like Dawson FF, Rayburn MG and Trebek CC look to you? Do you see black pillars on the sides only? Pillars are to be expected as the result of showing 4:3 content on a 16:9 display. I see pillars but they are excessively wide and the Buzzr logo is out of round. This changed some time last year. It used to be that the pillars were not as wide and the logo was perfectly round.

Pyramid80

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Re: Buzzr aspect ratio
« Reply #23 on: June 19, 2022, 12:14:31 PM »
KMSP channel 9 is divided into 4 subchannels, with Buzzr on channel 9.4.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KMSP-TV#KMSP-TV/WFTC_subchannels

How do shows like Dawson FF, Rayburn MG and Trebek CC look to you? Do you see black pillars on the sides only? Pillars are to be expected as the result of showing 4:3 content on a 16:9 display. I see pillars but they are excessively wide and the Buzzr logo is out of round. This changed some time last year. It used to be that the pillars were not as wide and the logo was perfectly round.

I see the black side pillars on all the shows Buzzr airs.  They’re always the same size, and everything is proportioned correctly.  I sometimes see ‘postage stamps’ with black pillars on the top and bottom as well during commercials shot in the 16:9 format and then swished into the 4:3 perspective for Buzzr, but that’s the only time I see postage stamps.  I never see postage stamps during the actual program.

chris319

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Re: Buzzr aspect ratio
« Reply #24 on: June 24, 2022, 06:32:46 PM »

I see the black side pillars on all the shows Buzzr airs.  They’re always the same size, and everything is proportioned correctly.  I sometimes see ‘postage stamps’ with black pillars on the top and bottom as well during commercials shot in the 16:9 format and then swished into the 4:3 perspective for Buzzr, but that’s the only time I see postage stamps.  I never see postage stamps during the actual program.

How does the lower-right logo look to you?

I can't think of a show running on Buzzr that was produced in 16:9, so the majority of shows can be expected to have pillars.

Pyramid80

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Re: Buzzr aspect ratio
« Reply #25 on: June 25, 2022, 09:13:56 AM »

I see the black side pillars on all the shows Buzzr airs.  They’re always the same size, and everything is proportioned correctly.  I sometimes see ‘postage stamps’ with black pillars on the top and bottom as well during commercials shot in the 16:9 format and then swished into the 4:3 perspective for Buzzr, but that’s the only time I see postage stamps.  I never see postage stamps during the actual program.

How does the lower-right logo look to you?

I can't think of a show running on Buzzr that was produced in 16:9, so the majority of shows can be expected to have pillars.
The Buzzr logo is a perfect circle.  Everything is in the correct perspective.  If something were off, I would change the aspect ratio to fit, but I rarely adjust it from 16:9.