The Game Show Forum
The Game Show Forum => The Big Board => Topic started by: 14gameshows on June 08, 2012, 09:51:12 PM
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When Password was cancelled on ABC, did G-T immediately try to rework or retool Password and shop it to over NBC or CBS? I know it debuted a few years later on NBC but was CBS ever considered as a possible network to show it on.
Also how did the "Password Puzzle" and "Alphabetics" format come about? Did G-T have another format in place before the finished product that we saw on television?
Finally, what was the cause of the cancellation of Password Plus back in 1982, all for it to come back just two years later with a new name, host, music, etc. and then placed at a death slot of 12 noon and last for 5 years???
Goodson must have really loved this show and wanted it to work. Was this a personal favorite of his?
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IsTR reading that either Truth or Secret was Goodson's favorite. I want to say Truth.
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It was Truth.
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When Password was cancelled on ABC, did G-T immediately try to rework or retool Password and shop it to over NBC or CBS? I know it debuted a few years later on NBC but was CBS ever considered as a possible network to show it on.
Also how did the "Password Puzzle" and "Alphabetics" format come about? Did G-T have another format in place before the finished product that we saw on television?
Finally, what was the cause of the cancellation of Password Plus back in 1982, all for it to come back just two years later with a new name, host, music, etc. and then placed at a death slot of 12 noon and last for 5 years???
Goodson must have really loved this show and wanted it to work. Was this a personal favorite of his?
Password Plus originally was to be called 'Password '79'. The Password Puzzles and Alphabetics game concepts were created by Steve Ryan (who would later create the rebus puzzles on 'Classic Concentration' we all know and love). In run-throughs of the game, Carol Burnett (whom Mark Goodson called to play--and was a good 'Password' player) liked the game so much, she said, "It's more than Password...It's Password Plus!" Mark Goodson saw the genius in her statement, and quickly changed the name of the show.
The show was cancelled in March 1982, due mainly to low ratings, and that the show was getting tired. Originally, it took $300 to win a game, and by the fall of 1981, $500 won the game (with the first three puzzles worth $100, and $200 each puzzle thereafter--with the players switching celebrity partners). Tom Kennedy did a great job, replacing the 'irreplaceable' Allen Ludden, making P+ his own show.
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When Password was cancelled on ABC, did G-T immediately try to rework or retool Password and shop it to over NBC or CBS? I know it debuted a few years later on NBC but was CBS ever considered as a possible network to show it on.
Also how did the "Password Puzzle" and "Alphabetics" format come about? Did G-T have another format in place before the finished product that we saw on television?
Finally, what was the cause of the cancellation of Password Plus back in 1982, all for it to come back just two years later with a new name, host, music, etc. and then placed at a death slot of 12 noon and last for 5 years???
Goodson must have really loved this show and wanted it to work. Was this a personal favorite of his?
Very good questions. Unfortunately I do not know the answers, but I can attempt to provide some educational speculation to answer them.
My guess about G&T immediately trying to rework or retool Password is "no". It seems they monkeyed around with the format quite a bit, between having an elimination game, and a somewhat complex bonus game. Not sure, but I would well imagine since NBC & CBS were the only other 2 major networks at the time, that G&T definitely considered trying to "shop around" to find a new network.
My guess is the Password Puzzle came about so that the audience at home could play along more. One of the "flaws" of Password was you always saw and/or heard what the password was, and while it made for some very amusing television watching, for me the viewer, something is always taken away for me at least when I watch a show like this or Pyramid, where I already know the answer ahead of time. And while one could cover up the bottom of the screen with cardboard or something, it somehow takes away from being able to watch the show without having to do anything extra. Alphabetics was simply an extension of the old "Lightning Round" utilized on the original "Password", played for much bigger stakes, and the added benefit of knowing the first letter of each word.
The cancellation of "Plus" back in 1982 was most likely due to low ratings, coupled with the fact that Allen Ludden had died. Both Bill Cullen and Tom Kennedy were sensational substitute hosts. I know Bill pinch hit for Allen when he was ill, and Tom took over when Allen became ill again and then died. Much as I loved this game, I always felt a sadness when Kennedy was hosting, because I knew this meant Allen was ill, dying and/or already deceased. Whether Allen's death contributed in any way, shape or form to low ratings is anybody's guess.
Super Password debuted in 1984, and as far as I can recall, was always on at noon Eastern Standard Time. It seems the mid 80s was the beginning of the end of the daytime game show genre, and it more or less died out around 1990 or so. I would assume back in 1984, there were still a decent number of people (e.g. housewives) that were home to watch game shows and soaps, since daytime lineups contained many more gameshows and soap operas in 1984 vs. today. Also, noon wasn't always a "death slot" for game shows. Jeopardy! thrived for a very long time when it was on at noon. Only when its time slot was changed did it begin to mess things up. Convy was an amusing host and the show had a decent run, from Sept. 1984 - March 1989, but it was never quite the same as Password Plus when Allen was on. The Super Password set always seemed so "empty" and had a temporary feel to it, much like Donny Osmond's "Pyramid" did to me, though the Super Password set was much warmer and brighter than Donnymid's.
I imagine too part of the reason Password fizzled out is after almost 30 years being on the air (1961 - 1989), just about every feasible word was played several times. I was, and still am, very surprised that it did not have any kind of re-incarnation during the 1990s. The Million Dollar Password game was very bland to watch, and not enjoyable. It was far too fast-paced the entire time. All other versions of Password had a combination of slow and fast. M.D.P. reminded me too much of Pyramid.
I believe a 1990s version of Password could have worked, and I always fancied Bob Goen to be an excellent choice to emcee this game.
As a side note, and you may already know this, the original name for "Password Plus" was to be "Password '79", similar to how Match Game tacked on the last 2 digits of the year. Supposedly Carol Burnett inspired the name of the show, with the addition of the puzzle and she said "This is Password, plus!" I'm not sure if that was the case, and if so how it was the case. I wonder if she was part of a pilot episode or something and that's how this came about, because when the first episodes aired in January 1979, it was already called "Password Plus".
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When Password was cancelled on ABC, did G-T immediately try to rework or retool Password and shop it to over NBC or CBS? I know it debuted a few years later on NBC but was CBS ever considered as a possible network to show it on.
Also how did the "Password Puzzle" and "Alphabetics" format come about? Did G-T have another format in place before the finished product that we saw on television?
Finally, what was the cause of the cancellation of Password Plus back in 1982, all for it to come back just two years later with a new name, host, music, etc. and then placed at a death slot of 12 noon and last for 5 years???
Goodson must have really loved this show and wanted it to work. Was this a personal favorite of his?
Very good questions. Unfortunately I do not know the answers, but I can attempt to provide some educational speculation to answer them.
My guess about G&T immediately trying to rework or retool Password is "no". It seems they monkeyed around with the format quite a bit, between having an elimination game, and a somewhat complex bonus game. Not sure, but I would well imagine since NBC & CBS were the only other 2 major networks at the time, that G&T definitely considered trying to "shop around" to find a new network.
My guess is the Password Puzzle came about so that the audience at home could play along more. One of the "flaws" of Password was you always saw and/or heard what the password was, and while it made for some very amusing television watching, for me the viewer, something is always taken away for me at least when I watch a show like this or Pyramid, where I already know the answer ahead of time. And while one could cover up the bottom of the screen with cardboard or something, it somehow takes away from being able to watch the show without having to do anything extra. Alphabetics was simply an extension of the old "Lightning Round" utilized on the original "Password", played for much bigger stakes, and the added benefit of knowing the first letter of each word.
The cancellation of "Plus" back in 1982 was most likely due to low ratings, coupled with the fact that Allen Ludden had died. Both Bill Cullen and Tom Kennedy were sensational substitute hosts. I know Bill pinch hit for Allen when he was ill, and Tom took over when Allen became ill again and then died. Much as I loved this game, I always felt a sadness when Kennedy was hosting, because I knew this meant Allen was ill, dying and/or already deceased. Whether Allen's death contributed in any way, shape or form to low ratings is anybody's guess.
Super Password debuted in 1984, and as far as I can recall, was always on at noon Eastern Standard Time. It seems the mid 80s was the beginning of the end of the daytime game show genre, and it more or less died out around 1990 or so. I would assume back in 1984, there were still a decent number of people (e.g. housewives) that were home to watch game shows and soaps, since daytime lineups contained many more gameshows and soap operas in 1984 vs. today. Also, noon wasn't always a "death slot" for game shows. Jeopardy! thrived for a very long time when it was on at noon. Only when its time slot was changed did it begin to mess things up. Convy was an amusing host and the show had a decent run, from Sept. 1984 - March 1989, but it was never quite the same as Password Plus when Allen was on. The Super Password set always seemed so "empty" and had a temporary feel to it, much like Donny Osmond's "Pyramid" did to me, though the Super Password set was much warmer and brighter than Donnymid's.
I imagine too part of the reason Password fizzled out is after almost 30 years being on the air (1961 - 1989), just about every feasible word was played several times. I was, and still am, very surprised that it did not have any kind of re-incarnation during the 1990s. The Million Dollar Password game was very bland to watch, and not enjoyable. It was far too fast-paced the entire time. All other versions of Password had a combination of slow and fast. M.D.P. reminded me too much of Pyramid.
I believe a 1990s version of Password could have worked, and I always fancied Bob Goen to be an excellent choice to emcee this game.
As a side note, and you may already know this, the original name for "Password Plus" was to be "Password '79", similar to how Match Game tacked on the last 2 digits of the year. Supposedly Carol Burnett inspired the name of the show, with the addition of the puzzle and she said "This is Password, plus!" I'm not sure if that was the case, and if so how it was the case. I wonder if she was part of a pilot episode or something and that's how this came about, because when the first episodes aired in January 1979, it was already called "Password Plus".
Holy Wikipedia Batman!
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When Password was cancelled on ABC, did G-T immediately try to rework or retool Password and shop it to over NBC or CBS? I know it debuted a few years later on NBC but was CBS ever considered as a possible network to show it on.
Also how did the "Password Puzzle" and "Alphabetics" format come about? Did G-T have another format in place before the finished product that we saw on television?
Finally, what was the cause of the cancellation of Password Plus back in 1982, all for it to come back just two years later with a new name, host, music, etc. and then placed at a death slot of 12 noon and last for 5 years???
Goodson must have really loved this show and wanted it to work. Was this a personal favorite of his?
Very good questions. Unfortunately I do not know the answers, but I can attempt to provide some educational speculation to answer them.
My guess about G&T immediately trying to rework or retool Password is "no". It seems they monkeyed around with the format quite a bit, between having an elimination game, and a somewhat complex bonus game. Not sure, but I would well imagine since NBC & CBS were the only other 2 major networks at the time, that G&T definitely considered trying to "shop around" to find a new network.
My guess is the Password Puzzle came about so that the audience at home could play along more. One of the "flaws" of Password was you always saw and/or heard what the password was, and while it made for some very amusing television watching, for me the viewer, something is always taken away for me at least when I watch a show like this or Pyramid, where I already know the answer ahead of time. And while one could cover up the bottom of the screen with cardboard or something, it somehow takes away from being able to watch the show without having to do anything extra. Alphabetics was simply an extension of the old "Lightning Round" utilized on the original "Password", played for much bigger stakes, and the added benefit of knowing the first letter of each word.
The cancellation of "Plus" back in 1982 was most likely due to low ratings, coupled with the fact that Allen Ludden had died. Both Bill Cullen and Tom Kennedy were sensational substitute hosts. I know Bill pinch hit for Allen when he was ill, and Tom took over when Allen became ill again and then died. Much as I loved this game, I always felt a sadness when Kennedy was hosting, because I knew this meant Allen was ill, dying and/or already deceased. Whether Allen's death contributed in any way, shape or form to low ratings is anybody's guess.
Super Password debuted in 1984, and as far as I can recall, was always on at noon Eastern Standard Time. It seems the mid 80s was the beginning of the end of the daytime game show genre, and it more or less died out around 1990 or so. I would assume back in 1984, there were still a decent number of people (e.g. housewives) that were home to watch game shows and soaps, since daytime lineups contained many more gameshows and soap operas in 1984 vs. today. Also, noon wasn't always a "death slot" for game shows. Jeopardy! thrived for a very long time when it was on at noon. Only when its time slot was changed did it begin to mess things up. Convy was an amusing host and the show had a decent run, from Sept. 1984 - March 1989, but it was never quite the same as Password Plus when Allen was on. The Super Password set always seemed so "empty" and had a temporary feel to it, much like Donny Osmond's "Pyramid" did to me, though the Super Password set was much warmer and brighter than Donnymid's.
I imagine too part of the reason Password fizzled out is after almost 30 years being on the air (1961 - 1989), just about every feasible word was played several times. I was, and still am, very surprised that it did not have any kind of re-incarnation during the 1990s. The Million Dollar Password game was very bland to watch, and not enjoyable. It was far too fast-paced the entire time. All other versions of Password had a combination of slow and fast. M.D.P. reminded me too much of Pyramid.
I believe a 1990s version of Password could have worked, and I always fancied Bob Goen to be an excellent choice to emcee this game.
As a side note, and you may already know this, the original name for "Password Plus" was to be "Password '79", similar to how Match Game tacked on the last 2 digits of the year. Supposedly Carol Burnett inspired the name of the show, with the addition of the puzzle and she said "This is Password, plus!" I'm not sure if that was the case, and if so how it was the case. I wonder if she was part of a pilot episode or something and that's how this came about, because when the first episodes aired in January 1979, it was already called "Password Plus".
Holy Wikipedia Batman!
Ha ha! Thanks :)
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(massive overquoting snipped)
Ha ha! Thanks :)
And whoosh.
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12 Noon "death slot"? Not so in my neck of the woods. SP aired at 3:30 PM on KYW-TV 3 for many years in the mid-late 1980s sfter Scrabble at 3 PM. That was fine by me. At least I had 2 game show blocks at that time. The morning one(10 AM-12 Noon) & the afternoon block(3-5 PM(sometimes it got extended to 6 PM thanks to USA Network)).
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Holy overquoting, Batman! Quoting War and Peace to add a 3-word reply? Young Kevin knows how to play the game.
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That wasn't a compliment.
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Very good questions. Unfortunately I do not know the answers, but I can attempt to provide some educational speculation to answer them.
My guess about G&T..................
My guess is....................
I imagine.........................
I believe..........................
Holy smokes. You're right. You should post more. Lots more.
As a side note, and you may already know this
I do, so you don't have to teach me.
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Holy overquoting, Batman! Quoting War and Peace to add a 3-word reply? Young Kevin knows how to play the game.
I felt it necessary in this case. I had to illustrate my point and thought the best way to do so was to leave Bill's post quoted in its entirety.
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Holy overquoting, Batman! Quoting War and Peace to add a 3-word reply? Young Kevin knows how to play the game.
I felt it necessary in this case. I had to illustrate my point and thought the best way to do so was to leave Bill's post quoted in its entirety.
Only a small fraction of my post was meant for you, FWIW.
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Finally, what was the cause of the cancellation of Password Plus back in 1982, all for it to come back just two years later with a new name, host, music, etc. and then placed at a death slot of 12 noon and last for 5 years???
In 1982 (as with pretty much everything daytime or prime time at that time) NBC was pretty much throwing things to the wall and seeing what stuck.
By 1984, with NBC's fortunes turning around in prime time (thanks mainly to Bill Cosby), NBC could afford to be more patient with other dayparts in its schedule. SP may not have gotten the biggest audience around, but the quality of the show kind of spoke for itself (unlike, say, TIME MACHINE).
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Was NBC that bad off around 1982 or something??
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Was NBC that bad off around 1982 or something??
I would say so, considering their daytime ratings were in the toilet for a couple years prior (it seemed only Wheel was pulling its weight at the time) and their primetime lineup was just pitiful- a dying Little House and CHiPs?
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Was NBC that bad off around 1982 or something??
I would say so, considering their daytime ratings were in the toilet for a couple years prior (it seemed only Wheel was pulling its weight at the time) and their primetime lineup was just pitiful- a dying Little House and CHiPs?
They had a couple of successful sitcoms with Diff'rent Strokes and The Facts of Life. But other than that, NBC was in a position similar to where they are now.
Interesting to note that NBC didn't have a single Top 20 show in the 1981-82 (http://"http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/2008/04/04/we-look-back-at-the-top-tv-shows-of-1982/3203/") season.
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I would say so, considering their daytime ratings were in the toilet for a couple years prior (it seemed only Wheel was pulling its weight at the time) and their primetime lineup was just pitiful- a dying Little House and CHiPs?
When BATTLESTARS and BLOCKBUSTERS were cancelled (P+ had been canned a month earlier), essentially it was CHiPs reruns that replaced them (WoF took BB's slot and TEXAS moved from 3PM ET to 11AM ET). FANTASY ended up replacing the CHiPs reruns.
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Unless you can cite a source who worked there before I was hired, I can neither vouch for the Carol Burnett story nor the theory that Steve Ryan created the format. To the best of my knowledge Bobby Sherman created the format which was inspired by The Cross-Wits. The only office run-through I'm aware of was videotaped and featured Linda Kaye Henning and Richard Paul. What I can vouch for is that there was a record store called Music Plus on Vine street which was plainly visible from the P+ offices and which had a large plus sign on the storefront, just like the large plus sign used on the show. You don't suppose that's more than mere coincidence, do you?
The show continued for about a year and a half after Allen passed away, which blows the theory that his passing was a contributing factor to its cancellation.
To answer a question from another thread, the reason the chairs on the set were placed on tracks is that originally Ted Cooper intended to use motorized chairs and contestants would enter and exit through openings in the rear set wall on these motorized chairs. This bit of cruft is 100% untrue -- it is a story I just made up -- but I want to see how long it takes before some obsessed Ritalin-deprived fanb0i posts it somewhere as a true fact.
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To answer a question from another thread, the reason the chairs on the set were placed on tracks is that originally Ted Cooper intended to use motorized chairs and contestants would enter and exit through openings in the rear set wall on these motorized chairs. This bit of cruft is 100% untrue -- it is a story I just made up -- but I want to see how long it takes before some obsessed Ritalin-deprived fanb0i posts it somewhere as a true fact.
That would actually be awesome in its WTF-cheesiness. :)
/including the disclaimer to see if some yahoo *still* posts it as fact
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/including the disclaimer to see if some yahoo *still* posts it as fact
Or some smartass who does it to see if someone will come back in 6 months quoting it from Wiki...
/Don't look at me
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/including the disclaimer to see if some yahoo *still* posts it as fact
My good friend Mitt Dawson verified it for me that it is true. ;)
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My good friend Mitt Dawson verified it for me that it is true. ;)
Fun fact: "Mitt Dawson" is German for "with Dawson (http://"http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_4EzoY6ptXcM/TQOUNgfBdkI/AAAAAAAAACk/pgQCBYIp_PA/s1600/dawson-crying.jpg")."
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The password is "bowling buddy."
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/including the disclaimer to see if some yahoo *still* posts it as fact
Or some smartass who does it to see if someone will come back in 6 months quoting it from Wiki...
/Don't look at me
I never believe anything on the internet unless it is verified by two sources: Yahoo and Wiki.
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I never believe anything on the internet unless it is verified by two sources: Yahoo and Wiki.
Well there's no shortage of Yahoos. We all know that if it's in Wikipedia it must be true.