The Game Show Forum
The Game Show Forum => The Big Board => Topic started by: TheLastResort on March 05, 2009, 05:23:07 PM
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A couple of days ago, GSN just started rerunning the first week of P+, and it reminded me of a question I've always had. I think this has come up before, but I couldn't find the answer. During the first week, there was a small rectangular hole cut out in the front of Allen's podium. For the first couple of shows, it was reflective, like a mirror. Now it's brown to match the rest of the podium. By week two, it will be gone entirely.
So what the $%#! was it for? It looks too small to be a scoreboard. Was it some sort of password envelope dispenser? An opening for a stick mic? An extra swastika they decided to cover up??
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Chris Clementson, ATGS, 1998:
The passwords were grouped by puzzle and sat on a carousel on a shelf inside Allen's podium. The original idea was to install colored flags on this carousel so that they would peek through the aperture in such a way as to be visible to an observer on the audience side of the set. This way the producer could tell which set of passwords was facing Allen and whether they matched the next puzzle scheduled to be played. A clever NBC stage electronics guy replaced this whole system with a set of microswitches attached to the carousel which would activate a light at the producer's table, giving the producer the same information. The aperture in the podium thus became obsolete and was covered up with carpeting.
-Jason
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Interesting - thanks. Actually, I thought that's why the password envelopes themselves were color coded - so the producer could verify which puzzles the words belonged to. But I guess having the carousel wired to the production table gave them more time to check before Allen gave out the envelopes.
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[quote name=\'TheLastResort\' post=\'209619\' date=\'Mar 5 2009, 07:15 PM\']
Interesting - thanks. Actually, I thought that's why the password envelopes themselves were color coded - so the producer could verify which puzzles the words belonged to. But I guess having the carousel wired to the production table gave them more time to check before Allen gave out the envelopes.
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No, the envelopes were color coded to make sure the passwords in each puzzle were given in the right order. If you notice, the pattern of colors is always the same.
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[quote name=\'rjaguar3\' post=\'209623\' date=\'Mar 5 2009, 08:57 PM\']No, the envelopes were color coded to make sure the passwords in each puzzle were given in the right order. If you notice, the pattern of colors is always the same. [/quote]
Never noticed that. It sure was a colorful show, even if the set designer was a Nazi. :)
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Do you recall the order of the colors? I don't, but I recall there were red, green, yellow, salmon and some other color.
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I have said it before and i'll say it again : Had PPlus had Wheel's Million colors that they debuted a few years ago, PPlus would never have been cancelled, and would still be on the air today.
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[quote name=\'chris319\' post=\'209632\' date=\'Mar 5 2009, 09:17 PM\']
Do you recall the order of the colors? I don't, but I recall there were red, green, yellow, salmon and some other color.
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From looking at Youtube, the order is red, yellow, orange, green, peach, but I'm not sure on the 2nd and 3rd ones.
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[quote name=\'tvwxman\' post=\'209641\' date=\'Mar 5 2009, 11:34 PM\']
I have said it before and i'll say it again : Had PPlus had Wheel's Million colors that they debuted a few years ago, PPlus would never have been cancelled, and would still be on the air today.
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I dunno, Matt. Seems like having passwords in a million color-coded envelopes would slow down the game. And, damn, would that need to be a big puzzle board.
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[quote name=\'Clay Zambo\' post=\'209674\' date=\'Mar 6 2009, 04:36 PM\']
[quote name=\'tvwxman\' post=\'209641\' date=\'Mar 5 2009, 11:34 PM\']
I have said it before and i'll say it again : Had PPlus had Wheel's Million colors that they debuted a few years ago, PPlus would never have been cancelled, and would still be on the air today.
[/quote]
I dunno, Matt. Seems like having passwords in a million color-coded envelopes would slow down the game. And, damn, would that need to be a big puzzle board.
[/quote]
On the positive side, they wouldn't have to book as many contestants, and the budget would have been significantly lower.
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[quote name=\'Clay Zambo\' post=\'209674\' date=\'Mar 6 2009, 03:36 PM\']
I dunno, Matt. Seems like having passwords in a million color-coded envelopes would slow down the game. And, damn, would that need to be a big puzzle board.
[/quote]
And can you imagine how dumb those contestants would have to be if the puzzle went unsolved and they had to turn to the all-knowing audience?
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Another little quirk I've noticed from the early weeks of the show: Between each celebrity and Allen, there is a small microphone highlighted here (http://\"http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/6953/pplusmic.jpg\"). What was the point of these?
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[quote name=\'Mr. Matté\' post=\'209916\' date=\'Mar 9 2009, 12:05 PM\']
Another little quirk I've noticed from the early weeks of the show: Between each celebrity and Allen, there is a small microphone highlighted here (http://\"http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/6953/pplusmic.jpg\"). What was the point of these?
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Notice that the other microphone is pointed in the other direction, so if the celeb turns to talk to Allen, he's out of the mic's range.
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There is another mic on the opposite side of the frame, poking the contestant in the ribs.
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[quote name=\'chris319\' post=\'209985\' date=\'Mar 10 2009, 02:29 AM\'] There is another mic on the opposite side of the frame, poking the contestant in the ribs. [/quote]
There is also a GSN logo sitting on top of his head.
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So, okay, the main mics for the four panelists were highly directional, requiring additional coverage for times when they turned away from their main mics. I don't get *why* they used such highly directional mics, though. Is that all NBC had available? Of course in '79 they weren't expecting people, 30 years hence, to be able to do screengrabs and say, "Man, how unsightly were those deals!"--but, man! etc.
With what did they replace them? Anybody?
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[quote name=\'Clay Zambo\' post=\'209991\' date=\'Mar 10 2009, 08:10 AM\']
With what did they replace them? Anybody?
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If you're asking for model, the replacements were Sennheiser ME-80 shotguns.
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[quote name=\'Chief-O\' post=\'209994\' date=\'Mar 10 2009, 10:06 AM\']
[quote name=\'Clay Zambo\' post=\'209991\' date=\'Mar 10 2009, 08:10 AM\']
With what did they replace them? Anybody?
[/quote]
If you're asking for model, the replacements were Sennheiser ME-80 shotguns.
[/quote]
Which are less specifically directional, I take it, so the others weren't needed? Or were the annoying little weedy mics replaced with something smaller and less obtrusive?
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[quote name=\'Clay Zambo\' post=\'209995\' date=\'Mar 10 2009, 09:22 AM\']
Which are less specifically directional, I take it, so the others weren't needed? Or were the annoying little weedy mics replaced with something smaller and less obtrusive?
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The shotguns are condenser mics---by their nature, they're more sensitive than dynamic mics [such as the previous desk mics].
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[quote name=\'TheLastResort\' post=\'209987\' date=\'Mar 10 2009, 04:02 AM\']
[quote name=\'chris319\' post=\'209985\' date=\'Mar 10 2009, 02:29 AM\'] There is another mic on the opposite side of the frame, poking the contestant in the ribs. [/quote]
There is also a GSN logo sitting on top of his head.[/quote]
It was Ted Cooper's idea to build a GSN logo into the set.
We had fan noise from the projector under the desk, we had fan noise from the projector stage left, and we had various blowers in the Alphabetics board. Bobby and Ted decided the best way to mitigate the fan noise was to use those short shotguns. As has been pointed out, condenser mics pick up everything so they didn't help the noise situation that much.
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They didn't have clip-on mics back in the day?
Or would those have been technically problematic for some other reason?
Perhaps they should have outfitted the players with ginormous lavalier mics. :-)
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Lapel mics might have picked up more fan noise, and everyone would have to have been re-miced in the 15-minute wardrobe change between shows.
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What was the deal with using a projector for the puzzles, anyway? They eventually went to art cards, which couldn't have been any more expensive than the slides, which weren't aligned properly half the time.
Slightly OT, but Chris, did you ever work on Super Password? I've always been curious as to how the mechanics of the puzzle board worked. I know it was remote controlled from the producer's table, with Tom the prop guy behind the board to change the puzzles). They don't appear to be motorized because they don't open at a constant speed. It looks more like a magnetic contraption or a small rope & pulley system with counterweights.
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Projectors were NBC's idea, but were prone to fan noise and lamp failure.
Was never on the set of Super Password, sorry.
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As an afterthought, I don't know why only one wireless mic was used on P+ and five were used on Super Password. Perhaps they figured there would be five times the likelihood of interference. Digital wireless mics were some years off.
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[quote name=\'chris319\' post=\'210048\' date=\'Mar 10 2009, 10:10 PM\']
Lapel mics might have picked up more fan noise,
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I read that one before your earlier explanation about the mechanics of the displays and thought, "Wow, they really couldn't control the audience?"
D'oh.
Thanks for the explanation on the sawed-off shotguns. They weren't there later in the run, though, were they (or just better hidden)? Do you know what replaced them?
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[quote name=\'chris319\' post=\'210081\' date=\'Mar 11 2009, 02:27 AM\'] As an afterthought, I don't know why only one wireless mic was used on P+ and five were used on Super Password. Perhaps they figured there would be five times the likelihood of interference. Digital wireless mics were some years off. [/quote]
They seemed to have had a lot of trouble with the wireless mics on SP. There were a lot of instances of static, buzzing, belt packs not being turned on, etc., so I can see why they were avoided on P+.
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[quote name=\'TheLastResort\' post=\'210189\' date=\'Mar 12 2009, 09:39 AM\']
They seemed to have had a lot of trouble with the wireless mics on SP. There were a lot of instances of static, buzzing, belt packs not being turned on, etc., so I can see why they were avoided on P+.[/quote]
That doesn't surprise me, particularly with all the neon on SP the set. It's why Barker never used a wireless. Wireless mics and neon don't agree. Having contestants crane their necks to see the game board was a another problem.
There is about to be some upheaval over wireless mic frequencies due to DTV.
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They seemed to have had a lot of trouble with the wireless mics on SP. There were a lot of instances of static, buzzing, belt packs not being turned on, etc., so I can see why they were avoided on P+.
That doesn't surprise me, particularly with all the neon on SP the set. It's why Barker never used a wireless. Wireless mics and neon don't agree. Having contestants crane their necks to see the game board was a another problem.
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In the early episodes of SP, during the main game, they used to flash the neon border when one side won. You could hear plenty of wireless mic buzz during gameplay even without the flashing. Making goodbyes with extra "pulse" buzzing may have driven the change to keep the neon continuously lit instead. Just a guess, though...
Flashing neon interference didn't seem as noticeable during an end game win with crowd noise, music, etc.
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[quote name=\'scottwa\' post=\'211268\' date=\'Mar 26 2009, 05:38 PM\']
That doesn't surprise me, particularly with all the neon on SP the set. It's why Barker never used a wireless. Wireless mics and neon don't agree. Having contestants crane their necks to see the game board was a another problem. [/quote]
At a TPIR taping I was at in 1995, Barker explained that wireless mics have "drop out" which is why he used one with a cord.
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[quote name=\'BillCullen1\' post=\'211279\' date=\'Mar 26 2009, 07:33 PM\']
[quote name=\'scottwa\' post=\'211268\' date=\'Mar 26 2009, 05:38 PM\']
That doesn't surprise me, particularly with all the neon on SP the set. It's why Barker never used a wireless. Wireless mics and neon don't agree. Having contestants crane their necks to see the game board was a another problem. [/quote]
At a TPIR taping I was at in 1995, Barker explained that wireless mics have "drop out" which is why he used one with a cord.
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Aah. The old "dead spots" gambit. Well, I guess the technology improved enough by the time Carey became host to warrant its use.